Alicia Keys’ Diary: Evaluating the Follow-Up To A Legendary Debut | 50 For 50

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[SPEAKER_00]: we are back on 50 for 50.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, we are with an album that came out in 2000 in three December second 2003 to be exact.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The diary of Alicia Keys her follow up to the album that kind of

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[SPEAKER_00]: It broke my brain in a way when it came out because I was like, how can this young person be so sophisticated and yet so young and cool at the same time exactly, which was to me that was the Alicia Keys first album was like the idea that someone is young and hip and cool.

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[SPEAKER_00]: and hip hop to an extent, but had the classical piano background and really thought for her music to sound like that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So at least it keys back in, you know, when she dropped in the early 2000s.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She was like a child prodigy to me, like the same way you would think of like,

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[SPEAKER_00]: you know, Kevin Campbell or, you know, to use a television metaphor, doogie house or MD, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like, this was like just somebody who was like, you're like, all of us like one day I didn't know who Alicia Keys was.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then the next day I was like, OK, this woman is going to be in my life for as long as I live.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, you know, she wasn't Tevin Campbell or Dooby Houser Young.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, she was probably like 20 when her first album came out, but still, you know, we were not accustomed at that point to seeing young, I mean, young people, never mind young women, never mind young black women, who, you know, played instrument,

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[SPEAKER_01]: had classical training, but also damn sirens.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's how you know it's real.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's how you know we're recording and real time in our real homes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You can hear that you can hear stuff like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes indeed.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And also had like a very like hip hop edge tour.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She was definitely New York.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She had like a swag.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So it was kind of like,

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[SPEAKER_01]: somebody like Roberta Fleck, but also she had some Mary J. Bligener, like the closest thing to, I mean, so this is 2001 and her and India, I read and like tweet all came out at the same time, tweet and they were, yeah, you know, it is a blast from your past.

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[SPEAKER_01]: who all played instruments and, you know, who were all kind of these young fresh singer songwriters, they had a little bit of a hip-hop edge, but, you know, again, Alicia had that like New York City swagger.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And you're right, she does, when she does actually release her album, she is an adult, but in, you know, in doing the research, like if Columbia records had actually done a good job with her, we would have heard her

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think she has a song on the Men in Black soundtrack, which is from like 97 or 98, and then there was also There's a so-so-deft Christmas album, which I honestly only remember because Uncle Luke has a song on it

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[SPEAKER_01]: And, and it sounds exactly like what you would expect an Uncle Luke Christmas song sound?

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[SPEAKER_00]: What is it called like Santa Claus with no draws or something like that?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually, it's called Christmas time is party time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And it definitely sounds like Doodoo Brown has got to do it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But it's like Christmas song.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, Alicia Keys is on that album and she does a version of a little drummer boy.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But she was to been like 17 something like that when that came out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, so some depth was part of Columbia, the man in black soundtrack was on Columbia.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think they were trying to figure out what to do with their and they couldn't figure it out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So they dropped her and then Clyde Davis picked up the baton.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think when Clyde launched J records in 2001, she was like,

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[SPEAKER_01]: the third of the fourth artist to come out on that label was winning the first.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Now, wouldn't you still on Aristotle?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The first was

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[SPEAKER_01]: shit.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There was Olivia who we've since forgotten about.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There was Jimmy Cozier who we've also since forgotten about.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Who's actually on Alicia's first album and then there was Luther and then I think Alicia Keys might have been the fourth got it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But you know very early days of that label.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So we didn't know it at the time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: but Alicia Keys was in our life when she was a child.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, I just literally remembered that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She was on an a famous episode of the Cosby Show.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Cosby Show, we're Rudy has all of her friends over.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And she plays a character named Maria, who may have won the Bucking Horse Challenge if I remember incorrectly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yes indeed and you know when when she does come out as a as a artist and then you know back then in early 2000s the internet wasn't quite what it was today We would eventually that there was some yeah YouTube.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, this was at least a case when she was like six years old or something right so okay

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[SPEAKER_00]: So 2003 is the second album, the diary of Alicia Keys, and let's go back to 2003 because there's some crazy shit going on in 2003.

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[SPEAKER_00]: February 3rd 2003, the Martin Bashir, living with Michael Jackson, premieres on ITV and the UK, it airs on ABC in the US three days later, a total of 53 million viewers in the two countries watch the special of

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[SPEAKER_00]: Michael Jackson going into shops and just going, I want this, I want this, I want this, I want this and throwing it and just buying up stores supposedly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't remember anything else that was on that except for that part.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there was, he asked Martin Bashir, why doesn't he climb trees or something like that?

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[SPEAKER_01]: There's a famous clip.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It still is in memes and stuff like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Where, and this might have been, this might have been part of the response special that Michael put together where Michael talks about touring.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, they were like, say something nice about, like, he's like, oh, I hate touring.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, like, there's so much stuff going on and it's exhausting and like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And they're like, well, Mike, you can't say that like say something positive, so Mike completely like switches up as a music.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I love touring and then everybody starts cracking up.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that has lived on as a mean, but yeah, man, that special was a big, I mean, you know, in a lot of ways, that sort of contributed to the end of Michael's life, I think in some ways.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And we'll get to it at the end of this, but there is stuff that comes out of 2003 that is very serious, right in in his life.

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[SPEAKER_00]: no doubt.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Food fighters, Beyonce and other performers, nor a Jones wins six awards, including all four in the general field, the year of nor a Jones indeed.

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[SPEAKER_00]: March 25, Celine Dion begins a new day her Las Vegas residency.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It would run for five years and over 700 shows.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That is insane.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, she kind of kicked that off, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: everybody does a Vegas run, you know, Bruno and boys to men, Janet and, you know, new addition, new kids, you know, everybody, like Vegas used to be this like corny place where you only saw like Wayne Newton, right, or like a thunder down under that David Copperfield shows.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but now Vegas is where like all the cool artists go and they post up for a couple months, so they don't have to travel.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They can bring their families with them.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And it's like a destination spot for people that want to see live music.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: April 16th, the aforementioned Luther Vandross suffers a severe stroke at his home in New York City.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He emerges from a coma seven weeks later.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That was rough man.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was just trying to go back in time because when does dance with my father come out Came out like a month later.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh my gosh We might have still been in a coma when that album came out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Whew April 28th

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[SPEAKER_00]: Apple opens the iTunes music store offering 200,000 songs for download at a cost of 99 cents each more than one million songs are sold in the stores first week now as we are recording That is 23 years prior almost to the to the month and it feels like a million years ago when we were spending a dollar to buy songs

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[SPEAKER_01]: I might be the only person in the world that still buys music off of iTunes.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Do you still buy singles and stuff?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I mean, if Ali, because I like to own stuff, I don't like renting my music, licensing, licensing for your monthly, just like your cable bill.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so if I can't buy a CD and, you know, a lot of artists don't release records on CD anymore, I will buy it on iTunes just to A, be able to own the music and be put a little bit more money in the artists, you know, bank account because I actually bought something as opposed to just streaming it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Does every album that hits streaming actually also come out for download on iTunes?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't know that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't know that that was still part of the artist, you know, game plan as like we have to have all these different versions because like for instance, I'll just use Taylor Swift because she's the one who does this the most, but like you have like seven different versions of the CD that goes to all of these different outlets like target and her website and all these different things and you know, there there are

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[SPEAKER_00]: except for like maybe one little wrinkle or whatever.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But at the same time, I don't I don't hear her promoting, oh, you can also buy the digital download, which then has this extra thing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's never in the marketing for her stuff.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So I just assume that, oh yeah, maybe people don't even go to downloads anymore.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think if you, you know, when Taylor Swift puts out an album, I think if you actually go to her website, there are options.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You just do like a direct download from there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So she doesn't have to give any money to Apple.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She can just kind of keep it herself.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Interesting, interesting.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But you can also, I mean, pretty much every streaming service with the exception of Spotify offers a download component.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You can download from Amazon.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I maybe you can't download from the title, but Apple and Amazon for sure you can still download from.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I know Amazon because they always send me these things because I'm an Amazon prime member.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And, um, and so it's like, oh, you haven't used any of your Apple music stuff.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, what, yeah, because I have other ways to what Apple is like, I'm sorry, Amazon music stuff because I have other ways to do it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, back in the day,

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[SPEAKER_00]: Amazon, if you downloaded MP3s from Amazon, they wouldn't have that DRM on it, that software whatever, so that you couldn't then use it in other mediums, like so for instance, you wanted to create a YouTube video.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Not that I was going to use an artist's YouTube video and try to make money off of that YouTube video, but just kind of like a private one for your family.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you downloaded that song from Apple, it would have a specific software on it that did not let you import it to whatever movie making software you're going to use.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So what I would do is I would go to Amazon spend the 99 cents because it didn't have that software so then I could import it to use on the movie thing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if Amazon has that software or has that little thing on it yet, but that's what I would use it for back in the day.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: May 21st, Ruben Stuttered.

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[SPEAKER_00]: When it's the second season of American Idol, Edging Clay Aiken.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That was an interesting race.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He was the velvet teddy bear, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And like, I think I just assumed Clay was going to win.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then when Ruben won, I was like, oh, thank you, Ruben won.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, back when that stuff mattered, I guess.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Matter.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Now Ruben's on tour with jam and Lewis.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Is he really?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they're doing jam and loose are doing like a tour where they play like all their hits and they're male vocalist is Rubin started and their female vocalist is Shani's now that's amazing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think Shani's was a shot stockman.

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[SPEAKER_00]: John Stockman.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, man Tracy Spencer was on the most recent when I haven't gotten to watch that yet.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, Jim and Lewis man rocking it out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, okay, June of 14th, Justin Timberlick and Christina Aguilera kicked off their summer justified and stripped tour.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Did you have you ever seen either of them, I've seen both of them separately.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, not on this tour though.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I saw the follow up like I saw Justin on the future sex love sounds tour and I saw Christina on the, uh, I guess whatever album she put out after stripped, maybe it was back to basics, uh, double up with her on.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I saw her on that tour.

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[SPEAKER_00]: As a performer, uh, they're, I imagine they're completely different performers.

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[SPEAKER_00]: This Christina, like dance and stuff with her songs is much.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, she's got routines and stuff like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I would,

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[SPEAKER_01]: it's not like full-on choreography.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She's not doing like the Beyonce thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but you know, she has like her little routines and stuff like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But she's mostly singing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's good.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She's just an agglomerate.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, she put out a Christmas album late last year.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think really.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how old Christina Aguilar is, but she looks almost like, I mean, she's different, you know, her body is not like she wasn't she was 16 and she was a little tiny thing, but she still looks pretty much the same, like I'm surprised, she's she's a couple years younger than us, yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: All right, June 20th, Beyonce releases her number one debut solo album, Dangerously in Love, which would earn her five Grammys in a single night.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It also spawned two number one singles in the U.S. and has sold 11 million copies to date.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And crazy and love was everywhere.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was one of the albums that we thought about doing for this year.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We chose Alicia because we'll have a different Beyonce album down the line.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But it was pretty big and it was this idea.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I remember the Beyonce thing because

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[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, whenever somebody leaves a very popular group, it's not like she left because Destiny's child wasn't hitting anymore, like they were still at the peak of their powers, but she was like, this is the time for me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a solo artist.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, there's some people who are like, eh, she's good enough singer, this and that, but she just became a powerhouse.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I don't even really like

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[SPEAKER_00]: the second and the third album that much, but like as far as my appreciation of Beyonce, the solo artist, she's way bigger than any one album, like she's such a ginormous artist just in the sense of

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[SPEAKER_00]: celebrity, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, Beyonce is a brand.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, and I felt like it was always kind of inevitable that she was going to leave Destiny's child, especially when they started playing like musical chairs with the members.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, kicking.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then she's like, yeah, and then she started getting like movie roles, she was in Austin Powers movie and all that stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, all right, like, just put out out on her already.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like we know we know where this, uh, we know where this story is going.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She gets flagged for it, but I still think she's pretty good in dream girls.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, she's good in dream girls, but when Jennifer Hudson, the movie was meant to showcase Jennifer Hudson.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, the Florence Ballard character is the one that you feel sorry for as a human.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So that's kind of the heart of the movie.

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[SPEAKER_00]: With the Supreme's based on what dream girls is based off of.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: June 24th, Taylor Swift signs with RCA records, August 28th, Madonna sparks controversy by kissing both Brittany and Christina at the 2003 VMAs.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The situation even ignited a quick war of words between Brittany and Christina over the kiss.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't even remember what that was about.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Who cares?

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[SPEAKER_00]: October 4 just attention pouring all over the place.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, absolutely.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And a precursor to Brittany and Madonna being in a song together.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Right exactly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: October 4 Bruce Springstein and the East Street band, the rising tour concludes after 120 shows over 14 months with record setting sales in US stadiums during the summer and early autumn.

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[SPEAKER_00]: 9, 11 and everything around that and you know, kind of like a renaissance for him a little bit.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, it definitely.

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[SPEAKER_01]: sort of brought him back into the public's mind a little bit more prominently and I mean look you know I'm not the world's biggest Bruce Springsteen fan but I have seen him in concert and that man and his band know how to put on a show and for his age even then I mean Bruce is I think

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I when I saw him, he was probably in his like early to mid 60s and dude plays for like damn near three hours and runs up and down just all this stuff like just crazy crazy show.

18:41.880 --> 18:44.004
[SPEAKER_01]: One of one of the greatest life performers of all time.

18:45.185 --> 18:48.871
[SPEAKER_00]: Can't remember what documentary I've recently seen him on.

18:49.132 --> 18:50.714
[SPEAKER_00]: It may be the Billy Joel one.

18:50.855 --> 18:53.038
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't remember exactly, but

18:54.723 --> 19:24.291
[SPEAKER_00]: even like as an older guy like that did just as sharp as he ever was as far as like like his stick right his Bruce stick and Bruce being Bruce yeah like he's he's he's there and I think um I want to say he performed on the Howard Stern show a few years ago and uh like I don't know how well what he thinks his voice is like compared to what it was when

19:24.575 --> 19:35.392
[SPEAKER_00]: OK, October 20th, Brittany releases the first single meagants to music featuring Madonna from in the zone, marketed as a comeback single in the US.

19:35.412 --> 19:40.600
[SPEAKER_00]: It goes on to be an international success reaching top three in several countries.

19:40.640 --> 19:41.942
[SPEAKER_00]: This is kind of

19:42.428 --> 20:00.471
[SPEAKER_00]: Britney kind of getting a little bit older, not as not as not people don't want to hear her as as much and I think she kind of realizes it and we get into like a kind of a lot of stuff in her life happening as a result I think.

20:00.856 --> 20:04.339
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, me against the music is kind of an ass song.

20:04.619 --> 20:11.486
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not great, but the follow-up to me against the music was toxic, which is, you know, maybe when it's song songs.

20:11.506 --> 20:11.726
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

20:12.086 --> 20:12.346
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

20:12.867 --> 20:18.912
[SPEAKER_00]: But that it was kind of a time where you're like, okay, the cute act has kind of worn thin.

20:18.972 --> 20:23.096
[SPEAKER_00]: Now the focus is a little bit more on the music than it ever was.

20:23.917 --> 20:30.863
[SPEAKER_00]: And she's an adult and she's making some adult mistakes out there with her life, which she's still paying for today.

20:30.843 --> 20:32.706
[SPEAKER_00]: And she's still making mistakes too.

20:32.886 --> 20:41.200
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you kind of that there's a there's gonna be an insane Documentary about Britney Spears.

20:41.421 --> 20:48.953
[SPEAKER_00]: I think at some point, you know in our lifetimes, what we're gonna be like Oh my gosh, I can't believe all the things that were happening to her

20:49.372 --> 20:49.672
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

20:50.073 --> 20:50.313
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

20:50.393 --> 20:50.774
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

20:51.034 --> 20:56.962
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, and not certainly not to make light of, you know, in fact, that this woman has been struggling for a really, really long time.

20:58.163 --> 21:01.568
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, at the end of the day, I hope she finds her peace however she finds it.

21:01.688 --> 21:07.355
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, she sort of retired from the rat race, which is, you know, good for her.

21:08.537 --> 21:15.025
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, again, just, you know, hoping she finds her peace wherever she can find it.

21:16.287 --> 21:41.704
[SPEAKER_00]: October 29th a legal version of Napster relaunches as a pay service offering song downloads for 99 cents a piece or 999 for unlimited listening so a little bit ahead of the game to where music is right now though you can't have a service that essentially allows for

21:42.950 --> 21:50.504
[SPEAKER_00]: Unlimited downloads for no cost and then say, oh, now you can pay to do the same thing that apples do it.

21:50.524 --> 21:51.506
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just going to do with apple.

21:51.546 --> 21:53.409
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I'm not going to go up to Napster.

21:55.533 --> 21:57.837
[SPEAKER_01]: End of the road for Napster pretty much.

21:58.238 --> 21:59.340
[SPEAKER_01]: Which I never used.

21:59.460 --> 22:01.805
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, not to say I didn't illegally download music.

22:01.825 --> 22:02.707
[SPEAKER_01]: I illegally download it.

22:02.727 --> 22:04.330
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a ton of music.

22:04.710 --> 22:06.794
[SPEAKER_01]: But for whatever reason, I just never used Napster.

22:07.376 --> 22:13.868
[SPEAKER_00]: Napster was a time and place thing because what you needed with Napster.

22:14.067 --> 22:16.150
[SPEAKER_00]: was a fast line.

22:16.350 --> 22:25.885
[SPEAKER_00]: And in 2000, there weren't many, your home, your home internet, you know, was running so slow.

22:26.646 --> 22:33.296
[SPEAKER_00]: So you had to kind of be at an office that had some sort of DSL line in order for that thing to work properly.

22:33.596 --> 22:36.801
[SPEAKER_00]: Or you're basically downloading

22:36.781 --> 22:48.127
[SPEAKER_00]: and going to bed and hoping by the morning that the thing was was completely downloaded that was the other way to do it and you'd have to literally leave your computer on all night over night.

22:48.689 --> 22:55.785
[SPEAKER_00]: So like that was the thing, but if you were working in an office and you were I remember.

22:56.474 --> 23:13.421
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, in a, so January of 2000 is what I started to work for opinions and with, with a startup company like that, you kind of have like top level young engineers who are kind of ahead of the game on a lot of things.

23:14.223 --> 23:16.947
[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember there's one guy.

23:16.927 --> 23:43.112
[SPEAKER_00]: Who's he was pretty famous at the time because he had something technical that that he had figured out that became a part of of just the internet and how it worked and he told all of us and like this is we're all literally on Napster right like this is not like the company or HR going like okay don't mess with this stuff like average and everyone's on it and like you know from the top to the bottom and he said.

23:44.894 --> 23:45.735
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

23:46.070 --> 23:55.162
[SPEAKER_00]: What's going to happen is the copyright essentially copyright infringement and for who's willing to fight it.

23:56.423 --> 24:06.917
[SPEAKER_00]: But the way that we get in trouble as users is if we share what we have.

24:07.698 --> 24:11.723
[SPEAKER_00]: And you just take and you don't give back.

24:12.361 --> 24:19.290
[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to be fine because they're going to be concerned about the people who are spreading the virality of Napster.

24:19.330 --> 24:21.052
[SPEAKER_00]: They're not going to be worried about what the people's is taking.

24:21.092 --> 24:30.425
[SPEAKER_00]: So because with Napster, you could share everything that you had out there in the ecosystem as well, or you could not, and just you could just download.

24:30.445 --> 24:34.470
[SPEAKER_00]: So we were all like, okay, we're just going to download and

24:34.450 --> 24:53.978
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, that's kind of like it was he was ahead of that game, but it was still not good, like we, I mean, if you want to look at it in a specific way, you're like, well, you know, technology kind of forces change, and so it's kind of what we have now was forced by this technology, but yeah, that was kind of how we did it back then.

24:54.667 --> 25:07.444
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just remember using whatever limoire, bizarre, whatever the hell it was, and you know, leaving my computer on overnight, because I had a dial-up connection and getting a million one viruses.

25:07.584 --> 25:08.505
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh yeah, of course.

25:10.808 --> 25:14.373
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so here's the serious piece that I mentioned with the Michael Jackson story.

25:15.073 --> 25:20.100
[SPEAKER_00]: November 20th, Michael Jackson is arrested on charges of child molestation.

25:20.080 --> 25:40.145
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, in light of these new accusations, the previous ones were 1993, the television network CBS chooses to pull the scheduled November 26 airing of the one hour television special intended to promote Jackson's new greatest hits album number ones.

25:40.225 --> 25:41.987
[SPEAKER_00]: I forgot about that part of this whole thing.

25:44.710 --> 25:47.674
[SPEAKER_00]: I, I definitely have that on CD somewhere.

25:48.245 --> 25:49.307
[SPEAKER_00]: It just came out on final.

25:49.648 --> 25:50.210
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no way.

25:50.971 --> 25:51.172
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

25:51.192 --> 25:53.217
[SPEAKER_00]: So you just picked it up.

25:53.818 --> 25:55.302
[SPEAKER_00]: I had a copy of South Handwell.

25:55.322 --> 25:57.046
[SPEAKER_00]: They know you, your people know you.

25:57.226 --> 25:59.431
[SPEAKER_00]: They're like, how do we make this man happy?

25:59.491 --> 26:00.634
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's how we do that.

26:01.289 --> 26:06.374
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I will say two years later, he'd be acquitted of all of those charges.

26:07.074 --> 26:07.715
[SPEAKER_00]: Correct.

26:07.735 --> 26:16.063
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, the Michael Jackson story continues, the Michael movie, as we are recording this, the Michael movie is not yet out.

26:16.643 --> 26:17.724
[SPEAKER_00]: It won't be out by the way.

26:17.764 --> 26:23.069
[SPEAKER_00]: This goes live, but it's from today, yeah, I think a month from today is when it comes out.

26:23.149 --> 26:30.216
[SPEAKER_00]: To we are recording on March 22nd, this episode probably will be somewhere mid-Mid April.

26:31.090 --> 26:59.477
[SPEAKER_00]: the there was an HBO documentary that that came out and there's been back and fourth on that this Michael movie that is not yet out as we're recording was originally going to feature some stuff about the charges but they pulled all of it out because there was something in an NDA that they didn't follow exactly so they were like we're not messing with the stuff

26:59.457 --> 27:12.113
[SPEAKER_00]: very similar to the other music biopics of like just the rise and you know some of the hurdles but I think this is going to be a mostly positive spin on the Michael Jackson story.

27:12.934 --> 27:15.156
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure, and I'm just there for the music man.

27:15.216 --> 27:25.549
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't really care about Jermaine's kid and not that I have anything bad to say about him but I'm there to hear the music

27:26.052 --> 27:30.638
[SPEAKER_00]: on and on in a movie theater speaker theater speakers.

27:31.059 --> 27:32.681
[SPEAKER_00]: I really don't care about the narrative.

27:32.801 --> 27:35.264
[SPEAKER_00]: I know what the narrative is front and back.

27:35.284 --> 27:38.168
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure I know it just as well as the people who put the narrative.

27:38.248 --> 27:39.229
[SPEAKER_00]: They're made the movie.

27:39.610 --> 27:39.950
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

27:40.351 --> 27:41.512
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm there for the music.

27:41.532 --> 27:41.753
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

27:42.033 --> 27:45.538
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, also the family was not involved.

27:46.339 --> 27:47.680
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't really seem like it.

27:47.760 --> 27:53.528
[SPEAKER_01]: And actually, you know what, that's probably better for the movie because if the family had been involved,

27:53.508 --> 27:56.932
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, additional stretching of the truth.

27:57.012 --> 27:59.515
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, so look, I'm going to watch the movie.

27:59.575 --> 28:00.897
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to take it all with a green assault.

28:01.037 --> 28:03.259
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to enjoy the music and that's that.

28:03.340 --> 28:09.827
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll do a review of the movie on an episode of the cool check in after it's released as well.

28:09.927 --> 28:15.634
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll have our thoughts that you can hear or watch on our YouTube page.

28:16.947 --> 28:41.757
[SPEAKER_00]: Did you see the breakfast club clip that was out there about I guess there was a screening for the family and Janet had some thoughts on it that maybe didn't It weren't 100% Connected with how germane thought and germane may have taken it as a way of like Your negativity could affect jafar's future career, you know, kind of thing.

28:42.209 --> 28:52.735
[SPEAKER_01]: I, you know, I heard about that and then I'm overseeing something, I guess Janet posted something saying that that didn't actually happen, um, I don't know, man.

28:52.895 --> 29:00.353
[SPEAKER_01]: I, you know, I, like, when I think of that conversation, the only thing I can think I can think of is Dremaine's hair.

29:01.531 --> 29:03.192
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Jimmy is looking out, right?

29:03.293 --> 29:12.401
[SPEAKER_00]: Germany has got a child or a son who is about to be on the big screen in front of millions and millions of people.

29:12.441 --> 29:13.322
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's looking out.

29:14.062 --> 29:25.032
[SPEAKER_00]: He's also making sure that, you know, this thing goes well, because for Jafar's future, of course, you want your kid to have more opportunities coming out of this.

29:25.993 --> 29:31.538
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't have a problem with Janet was like, yeah, that wasn't exactly

29:31.518 --> 29:35.524
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the way all movies are sure, you know, not a documentary.

29:36.345 --> 29:36.546
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

29:37.447 --> 29:43.877
[SPEAKER_01]: So, so Janet, Janet, you got money, you've got your good just chill.

29:44.899 --> 29:49.586
[SPEAKER_00]: So I, I was having a conversation with my kids the other day, my adult kids.

29:50.387 --> 29:51.028
[SPEAKER_00]: And, um,

29:52.122 --> 29:58.413
[SPEAKER_00]: JJ who is now 20 he'll be 26 this year later this year.

29:59.455 --> 30:06.648
[SPEAKER_00]: He's like, uh, he goes, I was listening just to some Mike Jack the other day and I was like, oh, it's for second.

30:06.668 --> 30:07.870
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, what are you talking about?

30:07.890 --> 30:09.072
[SPEAKER_00]: That's like, oh, okay.

30:09.092 --> 30:10.174
[SPEAKER_00]: He's talking about Michael Jackson.

30:10.936 --> 30:14.502
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like, he says something to the effect of,

30:15.882 --> 30:30.297
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I think he's I just think he's the goat any other kids throw the term goat out like everything like it's you know, still go he's one of my goats and I'm like how can you have more than one go the No, there's a bunch of all kinds of me's there's only one

30:30.867 --> 30:33.011
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's how that's how the kids use it these days.

30:33.051 --> 30:34.093
[SPEAKER_00]: They use it in that way.

30:34.974 --> 30:39.703
[SPEAKER_00]: So he was like, yeah, he's like, you know, next Renee was playing some music and I thought it was Michael Jackson.

30:40.064 --> 30:43.229
[SPEAKER_00]: So I just wanted to listen to, uh, you rock my world.

30:43.290 --> 30:45.714
[SPEAKER_00]: He's like, that's my number one Michael Jackson song of all time.

30:46.135 --> 30:47.998
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I told him I said, well,

30:47.978 --> 30:52.804
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to actually do two Michael Jackson albums for 50 for 50.

30:53.766 --> 30:58.292
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you want to add triumph, which we've already done, that would be three.

30:58.352 --> 31:06.643
[SPEAKER_00]: And the reason is because it's it's really how Mike and I connect or connected originally, just being Michael Jackson fans.

31:06.663 --> 31:10.408
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I think it's

31:10.388 --> 31:25.697
[SPEAKER_00]: audio show this this video network podcast network show that we do do more than one with him like we if we thought about it we could probably do two steve albums too because I think that would kind of be the next one that we connect the most with but

31:25.677 --> 31:32.868
[SPEAKER_00]: Michael Jackson, far and above, probably the person we've discussed, new addition right there, Stevie right there, Janet right there.

31:33.428 --> 31:38.295
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, MJ stands far and above as far as where we're our fandom lies.

31:38.336 --> 31:39.497
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're going to do too.

31:40.058 --> 31:46.167
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think we're going to do, and this is just a little bit of

31:48.087 --> 31:53.135
[SPEAKER_00]: off the wall, probably the week that the Michael Jackson movie comes out.

31:53.195 --> 32:02.529
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll figure it out as a way to make sure that that kind of connects for the week that the movie comes out or the week after the movie comes out whichever way it falls.

32:02.790 --> 32:05.073
[SPEAKER_00]: So.

32:05.334 --> 32:05.514
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

32:05.614 --> 32:06.015
[SPEAKER_00]: Cool.

32:06.295 --> 32:08.679
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

32:09.881 --> 32:14.668
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's focus back

32:14.885 --> 32:32.286
[SPEAKER_00]: government name, son of driver's license, and she now, Alicia Beats, like, what is yeah, I don't know what's this real name is, so I don't know what you caught that joke like five seconds before I

32:32.384 --> 32:33.665
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess, yeah.

32:34.186 --> 32:36.608
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, she's stage name, Alicia Keys.

32:36.628 --> 32:44.957
[SPEAKER_00]: Is there a better stage name than Alicia Keys, at least coming out as as she did.

32:45.517 --> 32:51.763
[SPEAKER_01]: piano player was really funny is we were talking about tweet earlier tweets actual last name is keys.

32:52.164 --> 32:52.584
[SPEAKER_01]: No way.

32:53.305 --> 32:54.486
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's incredible.

32:55.647 --> 32:58.290
[SPEAKER_00]: But so she couldn't come out with her.

32:58.928 --> 33:00.150
[SPEAKER_00]: real name, right?

33:00.451 --> 33:01.954
[SPEAKER_00]: If he's coming out of the two key.

33:01.974 --> 33:03.678
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, interesting.

33:04.740 --> 33:05.060
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

33:05.101 --> 33:11.293
[SPEAKER_00]: So a little bit of Alicia history here.

33:11.333 --> 33:17.426
[SPEAKER_00]: So we mentioned that she had this deal with Columbia and they just could not figure it out with her.

33:17.466 --> 33:19.570
[SPEAKER_00]: They wanted to make her

33:19.803 --> 33:40.680
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of like pop radio friendly producers like really her being involved less with the music and more with the singing and she just wanted to be invested in the whole thing, you know, she's been writing songs and stuff ever since she was a little kid so that did not vibe with her and she even mentioned.

33:40.660 --> 33:52.216
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how much in debt she's gone into it, but she was even saying like you know there were there were men like Propositioning her sexually and stuff and she's like a 16-year-old kid, man.

33:53.058 --> 33:54.560
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the music industry.

33:54.580 --> 33:54.780
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

33:54.900 --> 34:00.508
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I that doesn't justify it, but Believe me that shit happens.

34:01.332 --> 34:13.588
[SPEAKER_00]: And to tell you how ahead of the game, Alicia is, she graduated from high school at 16 and was school valedictorian at 16, which is in the middle.

34:14.189 --> 34:18.635
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's kind of why I was thinking in that way, like just a really sharp person.

34:20.578 --> 34:29.770
[SPEAKER_00]: So when she, the person who's kind of very influential in her, in where she ends up, is an R rep by the name of Peter Edge,

34:30.661 --> 34:39.677
[SPEAKER_00]: And Peter Edge saw her originally because there was like this, like, hey, there's this new artist.

34:39.698 --> 34:44.366
[SPEAKER_00]: She's going to perform in front of all of these people, like, you know, get your bids in kind of thing.

34:45.228 --> 34:50.357
[SPEAKER_00]: And he was very interested in her from there, but he was at Arista.

34:50.337 --> 35:15.180
[SPEAKER_00]: um she eventually goes to Columbia when she's trying to get out of her Columbia deal he comes he pops back up and helps her get out of that Columbia deal so that he can she can come to Arista but he's actually I don't think he goes to J records immediately like he stays at Arista but then he introduces her to climb and climb immediately as like okay she's she's it

35:16.477 --> 35:27.155
[SPEAKER_00]: What is your like I've never read anything about Clive the only thing I know about Clive back in the day was how highly Whitney always spoke about him.

35:27.235 --> 35:31.262
[SPEAKER_00]: But what is his kind of reputation like in in the music industry?

35:32.304 --> 35:36.190
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Clive Davis has been

35:36.760 --> 35:42.052
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, a very influential person in the music industry since to 60s.

35:42.553 --> 35:46.483
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's responsible for, you know, he signed Jan as traveling.

35:46.503 --> 35:47.866
[SPEAKER_01]: He signed earthwind and fire.

35:47.926 --> 35:51.394
[SPEAKER_01]: He signed.

35:51.965 --> 36:07.560
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, Philadelphia International Records, you know, all of these great artists, and then with Airsta, you know, Barry Manelow, Dionne Warwick, Arytha Franklin, Phyllis Highman, and then, you know, bad boy with a face.

36:08.241 --> 36:15.909
[SPEAKER_01]: So all of these sort of generations of music kind of tied back into Clyde Davis is kind of like a talent scout, I guess.

36:17.330 --> 36:20.233
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, obviously signed Whitney.

36:21.462 --> 36:35.505
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I, I, I want to be careful, but also, you know, I, he's kind of like the music industry godfather at this point.

36:36.106 --> 36:40.272
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, even now still has like a ton of of pull in the industry.

36:40.633 --> 36:45.681
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, he's also faced a fair amount of criticism for, um,

36:46.758 --> 36:59.156
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, pushing music that really didn't have any like bite to it, you know, or for being kind of an ego maniac and kind of putting himself above the music.

37:00.518 --> 37:15.499
[SPEAKER_01]: He was originally, I think, the president of Columbia Records and then actually got fired for like, misappropriating funds.

37:15.547 --> 37:16.349
[SPEAKER_01]: you can read his book.

37:17.592 --> 37:20.799
[SPEAKER_01]: There's also a ton of stuff on the internet about cloud Davis.

37:21.421 --> 37:24.829
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, there are lots of artists that have spoken negatively about him as well.

37:26.954 --> 37:29.901
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, I'm just saying there's a lot of information out there.

37:29.941 --> 37:31.986
[SPEAKER_01]: He is

37:33.063 --> 38:00.403
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, before the music executive was really kind of like prominent in the eyes of music listeners, he was really one of the first, if not the first, so, you know, just saying he is a, and still like he hosts a Grammy party every year, he's like 90 years old now, you know, still hosts a Grammy party every year that, you know, lots of influential artists go to, so, you know, he's still a big deal.

38:01.767 --> 38:07.978
[SPEAKER_00]: So the way that I wanted to do this, because we're obviously gonna talk a little bit more about the diary of Alicia Keys than these other albums.

38:08.259 --> 38:14.731
[SPEAKER_00]: But we also use these episodes to kind of talk about our thoughts about these artists and their bodies of work.

38:14.951 --> 38:24.889
[SPEAKER_00]: And I sent you a text earlier this week, and I was like, wow, Alicia Keys has created more albums than I remember.

38:25.072 --> 38:36.634
[SPEAKER_00]: And I didn't say it in a positive way necessarily it was more like I really remember the first four albums and everything after the first four albums

38:37.323 --> 38:48.837
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess I kind of remember them coming out, but they did not make as much of an impact on me, especially, because that's the only thing that I can really relate to.

38:48.877 --> 39:00.031
[SPEAKER_00]: But I don't sense that they also created that pick of an impact around music fans, necessarily or her fans, because they didn't hear anything about these albums.

39:00.051 --> 39:05.237
[SPEAKER_00]: Like in one of them, which is the last one that came out in 2021,

39:05.217 --> 39:15.419
[SPEAKER_00]: is a kind of a very interesting idea which was a double disk where she does originals using her classic piano style.

39:16.301 --> 39:24.880
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the other disk is more of like the same songs but produced, like, you know, produced with samples and such.

39:24.860 --> 39:26.702
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, oh, that's an interesting idea.

39:26.742 --> 39:29.504
[SPEAKER_00]: Why did I don't even remember that this thing came out?

39:29.905 --> 39:33.548
[SPEAKER_00]: So what is your relationship to her dysgography?

39:34.249 --> 39:36.671
[SPEAKER_00]: What is your relationship to a lot of her later works?

39:37.032 --> 39:41.696
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm just kind of curious if your response is kind of the same as mine.

39:42.657 --> 39:43.638
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the same as yours.

39:45.119 --> 39:47.962
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, the dividing line for me was growing on fire.

39:48.002 --> 39:50.284
[SPEAKER_01]: And that was the first, at least she keys out.

39:50.304 --> 39:52.947
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, hmm, this ain't all that good.

39:53.107 --> 39:54.428
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

39:55.015 --> 40:12.805
[SPEAKER_01]: And from there, like I, and I bought all of the rest of her albums and those were all kind of like one missing records for me, um, there wasn't much to like make me kind of come back and listen to anything and just kind of felt like she fell off after that girl on fire record.

40:14.995 --> 40:33.156
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, I did try and listen to some of these albums for you and you I just wanted to know like okay why was this not on my radar was it a me thing was it a her thing and she's got an album called here from 20 to 16.

40:33.136 --> 40:50.419
[SPEAKER_00]: which that was that was pretty good, but it wasn't there wasn't anything that I was like oh I remember that song or oh like that was like that makes me think of this thing it was just like oh I've almost I don't I don't know if I've ever listened to it before and I thought you know that was pretty good.

40:50.669 --> 40:53.212
[SPEAKER_00]: She put out an album that came out.

40:53.653 --> 41:02.285
[SPEAKER_00]: It was supposed to come out during the beginning of the pandemic and I think they pushed it back because Nobody knew what was going to happen.

41:03.046 --> 41:12.238
[SPEAKER_00]: And then she had done some she hosted the Grammys a couple times and so she was still in the mix and then, you know, like the pandemic did with a lot of stuff.

41:12.218 --> 41:22.839
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, kind of killed that project I'm assuming, and then she came out in 2021, but she's been out of of kind of the public eye since then she was on the Super Bowl show with usher.

41:22.920 --> 41:25.024
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's maybe the last time I saw her.

41:25.244 --> 41:25.645
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

41:26.186 --> 41:28.491
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, she so she did the voice.

41:30.034 --> 41:33.501
[SPEAKER_01]: She was a judge on the voice for a minute.

41:33.768 --> 41:37.391
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think right now she's probably focused on like being a mom.

41:37.451 --> 41:47.300
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, um, she's got health kitchen, which I think just closed, uh, but, um, you know, certainly, that's the Broadway show, right?

41:47.560 --> 42:03.775
[SPEAKER_01]: Broadway show was a popular track on, uh, popular show and Broadway for a bit, um, yeah, I'm like, I'm on Apple Music right now looking through her discovery and I'm like, okay, I remember these albums existing, but I don't really remember anything

42:03.755 --> 42:05.538
[SPEAKER_01]: about them.

42:07.222 --> 42:12.873
[SPEAKER_00]: So it just makes my like who Alicia is to me.

42:12.913 --> 42:23.333
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is completely unfair to Alicia, by the way, because I think she has been a very smart artist for the most part.

42:23.353 --> 42:24.936
[SPEAKER_00]: They're they're they're worse.

42:25.490 --> 42:30.700
[SPEAKER_00]: She's got some quotes that people thought were a little out of pocket, but everybody does.

42:30.720 --> 42:31.321
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

42:31.341 --> 42:35.269
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think her career has been very smart.

42:35.810 --> 42:47.532
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, you had the Swiss beats marriage, which may have started in the tabloids a little bit, which, you know, because he was previously married at the time.

42:47.512 --> 42:53.104
[SPEAKER_00]: but she's made, she's mostly made smart choices in her adult career.

42:53.886 --> 43:00.120
[SPEAKER_00]: And my viewpoint of Alicia Keys, as someone who's only four years younger than us.

43:00.910 --> 43:20.728
[SPEAKER_00]: Is one of, oh, this woman has actually done pretty much everything right from the perspective of how a young artist grows into adulthood, like she's not, I don't think I've ever seen her in a situation where I was like, oh, this poor person like made this mistake.

43:20.788 --> 43:28.875
[SPEAKER_00]: She's been very clean about that, but at the same time, when I think about the Alicia that I really, really love.

43:29.648 --> 43:31.651
[SPEAKER_00]: and mostly go back to the first two albums.

43:31.731 --> 43:35.398
[SPEAKER_00]: And I kind of wish that that was where the her music stayed.

43:35.718 --> 43:37.721
[SPEAKER_00]: But it can't because music has to evolve.

43:37.802 --> 43:40.466
[SPEAKER_00]: You evolve with the times you came here on you, Mom.

43:40.686 --> 43:41.908
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and you grow with your audience.

43:41.929 --> 43:42.950
[SPEAKER_00]: She became a wife.

43:43.010 --> 43:44.132
[SPEAKER_00]: She became a mom.

43:44.172 --> 43:46.035
[SPEAKER_00]: She became a business woman.

43:46.696 --> 43:48.960
[SPEAKER_00]: She has a Broadway play about her.

43:48.980 --> 43:53.007
[SPEAKER_00]: So she can't still be that 20 year old.

43:52.987 --> 44:04.188
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, super cool hip hop kind of adjacent, uh, b-girl style yet is classic piano at the same time.

44:04.228 --> 44:05.871
[SPEAKER_00]: She can't stay that at her whole career.

44:06.071 --> 44:12.323
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's where I'm like, that was the person that I was like, this woman is gonna take the world's, you know, on fire.

44:13.305 --> 44:15.990
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I think she just, you know,

44:17.759 --> 44:29.069
[SPEAKER_01]: When you sort of move away from the person you were at the time that happens to everybody, like people mature, people grow, people move into different circumstances.

44:29.750 --> 44:32.132
[SPEAKER_01]: And she became popular.

44:32.152 --> 44:38.358
[SPEAKER_01]: She couldn't walk around a city like nobody knew who she was.

44:38.378 --> 44:46.585
[SPEAKER_01]: You couldn't take in all that stuff, like a regular person would be able to.

44:47.122 --> 45:09.214
[SPEAKER_01]: And the same way that just, you know, going from year 20, you know, from when you're 21 to 28 to 35 to 45 like that's going to change your world view and that's going to change your art as well and you know, I think some of her later albums she's trying to wrestle with like being true to herself as an artist and also being like contemporary and making hits and

45:09.481 --> 45:21.954
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, the world we live in now and the way that people consume music, like, if you're just a pure artist, like you're probably not going to be extremely successful, unfortunately.

45:22.014 --> 45:39.252
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, I think she's the last few years, she's just kind of like fallen back and didn't like, I'm gonna do, you know, other stuff that, you know, keeps, you know, keeps the bags coming and, you know, maybe sort of step away from actually making records for a little bit.

45:40.531 --> 46:04.362
[SPEAKER_00]: The name of the game when you when you're having music career is how to make money on that music career to for for your you know this is your career and the steps that she took at least for those first three or four albums were the right steps because she increased at least first week out of sales.

46:04.865 --> 46:05.726
[SPEAKER_00]: from the first one.

46:05.766 --> 46:10.613
[SPEAKER_00]: The first one started nicely, but it percolated and bubbled into what it became.

46:11.174 --> 46:16.842
[SPEAKER_00]: But this back and album, which is the one that we're going to focus on, that opened much bigger than the first one.

46:17.042 --> 46:21.609
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was like everyone was just anticipating this album, right?

46:21.669 --> 46:23.852
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the third album, which

46:23.832 --> 46:31.999
[SPEAKER_00]: It even opened bigger than the second album, so the kind of how she did the arc of how she did it was right on and it was perfect.

46:32.660 --> 46:35.322
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, you're not always going to stay that hot, like who does?

46:35.422 --> 46:36.824
[SPEAKER_00]: Nobody, nobody knows.

46:36.844 --> 46:52.017
[SPEAKER_00]: So I just wanted to say that because when we talk about her and we're going to have our top five in our next episode, I'm going to guess that there's not going to be a lot of post, you know, fourth, fifth, fifth, seventh album stuff.

46:51.997 --> 46:56.306
[SPEAKER_00]: And in those lists, because it's just not as memorable, right?

46:56.326 --> 46:56.607
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

46:57.950 --> 47:07.170
[SPEAKER_00]: So, dire, release keys from a second album perspective, because we talk about this a lot,

47:08.095 --> 47:10.300
[SPEAKER_00]: artists put so much in that first album.

47:10.862 --> 47:18.440
[SPEAKER_00]: And then by the time the second album comes out, it's almost like they don't have anything left in the tank, but the time frame in which they became famous to the second album.

47:18.721 --> 47:23.111
[SPEAKER_00]: There's also so much pressure on them from an artist's label perspective.

47:24.434 --> 47:25.497
[SPEAKER_00]: She

47:27.046 --> 47:39.093
[SPEAKER_00]: didn't fall off and actually created something that I thought at the time, and I listened back, and I still think, it is like a more polished version of her debut.

47:39.975 --> 47:40.797
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I agree.

47:41.498 --> 47:41.899
[SPEAKER_01]: Um,

47:42.503 --> 48:12.021
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you're right, you know, you have your whole life to make your first album and then you have a concentrated amount of time to make that second album and that's where I think a lot of people can kind of fall into like a weird place where they're like, oh, I got to replicate this, but to me, like songs in A minor is a good album, Diary of Alicia Keys is songs in A minor on steroids kind of and, you know, that first album is kind of her and like,

48:12.507 --> 48:15.272
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, there aren't really like bigger names.

48:15.432 --> 48:25.732
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess really involved with that album so much where a second album has got Tim Beland and it's got Kanye and it's got, you know, all these other people on it to kind of like freshen her sound up a little bit.

48:26.633 --> 48:28.677
[SPEAKER_01]: So it feels like a step forward.

48:29.686 --> 48:48.268
[SPEAKER_00]: the theme, I guess if you give it a theme, you know, it's a song, it's an album by Love Songs and about vulnerability and, you know, always chasing love and complex relationships and stuff, from the soulfulness perspective.

48:48.248 --> 49:08.971
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, I think I thought she was able to lean into that very well because the first album does sound like a young person and the second album sounds like someone who's a little bit more mature, uh, not only in the love game, but also just in the music game, like you can tell like it in in songs in a minor.

49:09.492 --> 49:17.040
[SPEAKER_00]: Some of her songs were probably written from when she was like a teenager because some of her lyrics are very,

49:17.020 --> 49:26.981
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, teenagery, but this album, I think matures to that level two, because she's a grown person, but also a very successful artist.

49:27.001 --> 49:31.350
[SPEAKER_00]: And I thought she was able to dial into the sole aspect of this album very well.

49:31.921 --> 49:32.682
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree.

49:32.702 --> 49:45.478
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that it sounds a little bit more grown and maybe not as like innocent or, you know, to put it a different way doesn't sound as like wet behind the ears like, you know, sounds like she's learned some stuff.

49:45.498 --> 49:45.938
[SPEAKER_01]: She's grown.

49:45.979 --> 49:50.905
[SPEAKER_01]: She's experienced some stuff and she's putting that into the the music and the lyrics here.

49:51.966 --> 49:54.409
[SPEAKER_01]: Carry crucial brothers.

49:55.370 --> 49:56.832
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you know about this guy?

49:57.790 --> 50:15.040
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I know that, you know, Alicia shouted out crucial keys in every like acceptance speech for like five years straight, um, you know, and they were collaborators at one point, I think, maybe just for the first two records, um, you know, but.

50:16.252 --> 50:22.323
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I just know that they were, they were collaborators and then all of a sudden, they were not collaborating.

50:22.343 --> 50:34.345
[SPEAKER_00]: I was just kind of wondering what their relationship was like today because early on, but like when she was in this midst of Columbia in arrest and she was very unhappy, I think the first.

50:34.780 --> 50:41.213
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, maybe the first place that she moved away from her mom's house to kind of get away and to really start her career.

50:41.273 --> 50:43.638
[SPEAKER_00]: I think like they were roommates or something.

50:44.079 --> 50:51.895
[SPEAKER_00]: So they were that tight as far as as far as, uh, you know, how close they were and, um,

50:51.875 --> 51:10.812
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he he kind of helped her with the with some stuff and I don't know if he because he's like he's like he's older than us because I was like looking at it's like I'm like how close to the end age he's like 10 years old and her so I don't know what his experience in music was before her because I'd never heard of him before her

51:11.180 --> 51:11.601
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

51:11.961 --> 51:12.222
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

51:12.242 --> 51:12.963
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, me neither.

51:13.103 --> 51:18.331
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know that he's necessarily done anything since.

51:19.473 --> 51:22.698
[SPEAKER_01]: Allegedly, I'm just really quickly looking at Wikipedia.

51:26.724 --> 51:32.373
[SPEAKER_01]: That he worked with, you know, he's worked with NOS and Angie Stone and Drake, I guess.

51:32.774 --> 51:34.977
[SPEAKER_01]: Mario.

51:35.564 --> 51:43.776
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, primarily with Alicia Keys and, you know, yeah, I mean, he's just kind of like a sort of mystery person.

51:46.000 --> 51:56.796
[SPEAKER_00]: So like you mentioned, she has some young hit producers on this album, including Kanye West and Timbaland.

51:56.894 --> 52:11.325
[SPEAKER_00]: And she wanted a little bit of a rar sound, which I think was correct because the not to say songs in a minor was safe, but it's

52:11.423 --> 52:21.744
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's a younger person's album and this, you could get a little bit edgeier, especially with your song topics, you're a little bit of a smarter person, you've lived life a little bit more, you've lived success.

52:22.346 --> 52:26.935
[SPEAKER_00]: She doesn't live any failures yet with the first album, but

52:27.185 --> 52:28.467
[SPEAKER_00]: I always find it interesting.

52:28.507 --> 52:37.258
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, I think of it in sports, too, is like someone will have a good year and then, you know, what are you gonna do for your second year?

52:37.739 --> 52:54.120
[SPEAKER_00]: And they'll use words, you know, gonna get hungry or something and that's kind of like, well, this is like, I mean, to get raw with your sound, I don't know exactly what that means, but you have more say because you're more successful, so you could take a little bit more chances, I guess.

52:54.269 --> 53:02.643
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, you can argue that this album is maybe a little bit less produced than the first album is, um, I mean, I think it's kind of like splitting hairs.

53:02.663 --> 53:04.165
[SPEAKER_01]: They're both very produced records.

53:04.225 --> 53:04.906
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

53:04.926 --> 53:16.745
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, but you know, I mean, it, she's, you know, the first album was again pretty much like all Alicia and, you know, the second album has her step in out and working with some different folks.

53:17.206 --> 53:19.650
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

53:19.670 --> 53:20.952
[SPEAKER_00]: So the,

53:22.400 --> 53:28.530
[SPEAKER_00]: The critical reception was very positive, polished and mature.

53:28.650 --> 53:34.038
[SPEAKER_00]: We're a lot of the words used, retro soul.

53:34.079 --> 53:36.382
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you think about the term retro soul?

53:37.544 --> 53:38.866
[SPEAKER_01]: Me, retro soul is soul.

53:39.066 --> 53:40.990
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I don't know, exactly.

53:41.010 --> 53:42.272
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like Neo soul.

53:42.392 --> 53:44.475
[SPEAKER_01]: Neo soul is soul.

53:45.063 --> 53:55.575
[SPEAKER_01]: You, you, I don't know, it's kind of, it's a silly terminology to me, soul music is soul music, and if somebody contemporary is making soul music, it is contemporary, soul music.

53:56.056 --> 54:03.164
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think what they mean by that is just that, you know, she's playing real, you know, there are real instruments here.

54:03.184 --> 54:08.890
[SPEAKER_01]: The songwriting is a little bit more mature or adult oriented.

54:10.412 --> 54:13.095
[SPEAKER_01]: There's not as strong a,

54:14.307 --> 54:15.868
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's interesting, right?

54:15.969 --> 54:25.758
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you can tell Alicia has got like that hip hop vibe to her, but I don't think that if I remember correctly, there's no rapping on that album at all.

54:25.778 --> 54:26.338
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think so.

54:26.398 --> 54:26.979
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, is it?

54:27.039 --> 54:27.359
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

54:27.780 --> 54:36.528
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, it's like she made an album that had like a a little bit of a hip hop swag to it without using actual rappers.

54:36.548 --> 54:36.688
[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.

54:37.228 --> 54:43.234
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think, you know, already at that point, hip hop and

54:43.214 --> 54:58.492
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, there's a generation of folks who can hear an R&B album without a rapper, whatever R&B means in 2026, and be like, this is weird, but, you know, R&B and RAP are two different things.

54:59.834 --> 55:03.198
[SPEAKER_00]: So I didn't have a rapper on a music video from this album.

55:03.218 --> 55:03.859
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yes.

55:04.159 --> 55:07.063
[SPEAKER_01]: And both in multiple music videos from this album.

55:07.083 --> 55:07.483
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

55:07.463 --> 55:32.020
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, but yeah, I think that's what people are trying to say when they say like retro R&B kind of was basically so yeah, basically that it sounds like R&B before hip hop came into the picture and kind of how I took it is again, like we we always make fun of the term of neosol because it's supposed to be like this kind of new AG kind of, you know, sound retro souls like

55:32.000 --> 55:41.675
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what did soul music sound like in the seventies and how do we kind of, because we can't go back to the seventies, but we have new tools that can make it sound like that.

55:42.196 --> 55:45.120
[SPEAKER_00]: And we kind of lean into the influences a little bit more.

55:45.381 --> 55:59.222
[SPEAKER_00]: So I get it from that perspective, but it's just funny that you have to classify soul music by putting, you know, some sort of adjective in in front of it, which is, which is funny because yeah, everybody needs.

55:59.202 --> 56:03.629
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you have to be told what you're listening to, you can't just feel it, you know.

56:04.050 --> 56:07.235
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, you can't, and you can't make a determination for yourself.

56:08.176 --> 56:14.266
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so this album sold 618,000 copies in its first week.

56:14.286 --> 56:24.062
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, it came out late in the year, so December, you don't really see too many releases coming out in December as far as like like that, the hot, the hot,

56:24.042 --> 56:32.907
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the A1 albums coming out, like, you know, well, I mean, so this is pre-striving.

56:33.749 --> 56:34.491
[SPEAKER_01]: And

56:34.842 --> 56:51.681
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, you want to put you want your heavy hitters to come out towards the end of the year because people are buying at this time in history, people are buying records as like Christmas presents for people, but you don't just want it to qualify for the Grammys of the next year, and it'll qualify for the Grammys to follow.

56:51.701 --> 56:55.925
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, but then, but then that album is a year and half old by the time the Grammys are.

56:56.226 --> 57:02.993
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't, it doesn't didn't stop albums from like winning

57:02.973 --> 57:03.394
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

57:03.694 --> 57:13.149
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you wanted to hit that black Friday shopping, you know, when people actually went into stores in like late November through December.

57:13.209 --> 57:23.985
[SPEAKER_01]: So you would get like, you know, your Jay-Z, your DMX's, your, you know, big name artists putting albums out usually in like mid to late November.

57:23.965 --> 57:47.695
[SPEAKER_01]: And then in December, you might get like a stray release or two, usually from like a hip hop artist because, you know, kids would then have gift certificates or gift cards or whatever, and trade like whatever your backstory boys are in sync with your Britney record for like a DMX or a JZ or, you know, lip biscuit or whoever it was that was appealing to kids at the time.

57:47.675 --> 57:54.568
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, so it became more and more commonplace to put albums out in, you know, I mean, look, thriller came out on December 1st, right?

57:54.588 --> 57:59.397
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, they became more and more common for albums to come out like at the very end of a year.

57:59.558 --> 58:05.068
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember one of the marketing gimmicks from like, maybe the mid 2000s.

58:05.108 --> 58:09.717
[SPEAKER_00]: I forget like Christmas fell on a specific timeframe and all of a sudden is like,

58:09.697 --> 58:14.166
[SPEAKER_00]: Damn, Jamie Fox sold 800,000 albums for a week or so.

58:14.186 --> 58:14.487
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

58:15.048 --> 58:15.549
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

58:15.569 --> 58:15.810
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

58:15.830 --> 58:20.199
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, now I remember that that was there was a Jamie's album and Mary's album came out the same.

58:20.219 --> 58:23.065
[SPEAKER_01]: We can both of them sold over half a million copies in the first week.

58:23.345 --> 58:23.586
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

58:24.107 --> 58:24.287
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.

58:24.307 --> 58:25.149
[SPEAKER_00]: Good timing, man.

58:25.670 --> 58:26.813
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

58:26.873 --> 58:27.173
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

58:27.254 --> 58:29.899
[SPEAKER_00]: So you don't know my name.

58:30.031 --> 58:32.034
[SPEAKER_00]: first single goes to number three.

58:32.054 --> 58:43.130
[SPEAKER_00]: If I ain't got you, goes to number four and spent over a year on the charts and then diary goes to number eight.

58:44.512 --> 58:51.242
[SPEAKER_00]: Total sales, I have it as eight million worldwide and five times platinum in the US.

58:52.224 --> 58:52.804
[SPEAKER_00]: Sounds right.

58:53.606 --> 58:54.587
[SPEAKER_00]: So,

58:54.567 --> 59:01.575
[SPEAKER_00]: It, it followed up a juggernaut with, um, another juggernaut, which is, which is great for Alicia.

59:02.396 --> 59:03.577
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, a bigger juggernaut.

59:04.659 --> 59:05.139
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, all right.

59:05.239 --> 59:09.765
[SPEAKER_00]: So let's look at our Grammys redux.

59:10.045 --> 59:10.566
[SPEAKER_00]: We won't go.

59:10.586 --> 59:12.528
[SPEAKER_00]: We're only going to go through the first two albums.

59:12.588 --> 59:16.292
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just interested in your thoughts on, yeah, awards from the first two albums.

59:16.873 --> 59:23.781
[SPEAKER_00]: So 22 Grammys, which is songs in A minor,

59:25.128 --> 59:54.342
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... drops of jupiter by train miss jackson by outcast fallen by leech of keys video india arey walk on by you two and i'm pretty sure you two one uh... you know was right after nine eleven and you know people tied you two into that you know very prominently uh... i mean the best on out of those five is probably miss jackson i was gonna say yeah but i'd actually like all five of those songs

59:54.642 --> 01:00:01.731
[SPEAKER_00]: Song of the year video in the early stuck in a moment, you can't get out of YouTube.

01:00:02.892 --> 01:00:04.995
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like a bird, Nelly for Tato.

01:00:05.155 --> 01:00:05.916
[SPEAKER_00]: Nelly for Tato.

01:00:06.316 --> 01:00:21.595
[SPEAKER_00]: Drops of Jupiter, Charlie Cole and songwriters, bunch of songwriters, and then fallen Alicia Keys.

01:00:21.845 --> 01:00:23.608
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm also assuming you two won that.

01:00:24.069 --> 01:00:25.051
[SPEAKER_01]: At least she keys one.

01:00:25.071 --> 01:00:27.034
[SPEAKER_01]: Did she song you won?

01:00:27.094 --> 01:00:41.099
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, so here's my, the one beef that I have with fallen is that it very obviously samples or is based on its demands worldwide James Brown and it is not credited at all.

01:00:41.660 --> 01:00:43.583
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.

01:00:44.542 --> 01:00:53.202
[SPEAKER_01]: Which whatever, um, I mean, for you, I mean, brown, brown, you know, I fall in love falling.

01:00:53.282 --> 01:00:54.485
[SPEAKER_01]: I love, I think it's a great song.

01:00:55.127 --> 01:00:55.648
[SPEAKER_01]: Um,

01:00:56.185 --> 01:01:09.283
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, this is where I would probably either go to YouTube or India Ari who got, I think she went like, oh, for six or over eight at that Grammy ceremony and, you know, just got just kind of bad.

01:01:09.363 --> 01:01:16.092
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, she came out at the same time as Alicia Keys and kind of that might be the cause of why she didn't end up winning anything.

01:01:16.553 --> 01:01:19.197
[SPEAKER_01]: But, uh, you know, that first India Ari album is pretty good.

01:01:20.659 --> 01:01:23.863
[SPEAKER_00]: She also won Alicia also won Best Army album.

01:01:24.097 --> 01:01:26.601
[SPEAKER_00]: uh, and best R&B song.

01:01:27.243 --> 01:01:28.605
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, she won Best New Artist.

01:01:28.865 --> 01:01:30.188
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and she did win Best New Artist.

01:01:31.210 --> 01:01:31.310
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:01:31.330 --> 01:01:49.041
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, 20, 2005 Grammys, song of the year, the reason, which the artist was who was tank, live like you were dying, Tim McGraw song.

01:01:49.173 --> 01:02:18.387
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... jesus walks connier and who is a sea smith that shacemith that's my best okay got it got it got it yet if i ain't got you at least you keys and dotters by john mayor john mayor one uh... i remember being really salty because dotters might be one of john mayor's worst songs um... man that's a hard one uh...

01:02:18.653 --> 01:02:21.677
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, I don't even know if I know that Tim McGraw song.

01:02:21.757 --> 01:02:23.179
[SPEAKER_01]: I know the hoop is I know that song.

01:02:23.880 --> 01:02:26.884
[SPEAKER_01]: I know the Tim McGraw song is actually very good.

01:02:26.904 --> 01:02:29.307
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's about his dad who I think had passed away tug.

01:02:29.547 --> 01:02:31.309
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think tug, yeah, it's about tug McGraw.

01:02:32.311 --> 01:02:34.954
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, who I think had passed away like the year before or something like that.

01:02:36.296 --> 01:02:38.579
[SPEAKER_01]: Jesus walks is actually pretty incredible.

01:02:38.879 --> 01:02:41.222
[SPEAKER_01]: Break from a songwriting perspective.

01:02:41.763 --> 01:02:42.143
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

01:02:42.524 --> 01:02:48.171
[SPEAKER_01]: Gee, I mean, I might actually give that award to Jesus walks.

01:02:48.809 --> 01:03:00.571
[SPEAKER_00]: Calls drop out Kanye West, Confessions, Usher, Dyer, Dyer, Valicia Keys, American Idiot Green Day, Genius Loves Company, Ray Charles, and various artists.

01:03:01.332 --> 01:03:12.032
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Ray Charles won because you just passed away, but those other four albums are all like great, great records.

01:03:12.788 --> 01:03:15.933
[SPEAKER_01]: I hate that we're talking so much about Kanye, man.

01:03:15.953 --> 01:03:17.916
[SPEAKER_01]: I call his dropout.

01:03:17.936 --> 01:03:19.639
[SPEAKER_01]: I would probably give it to Kanye.

01:03:20.140 --> 01:03:23.325
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, or that usher album is a month.

01:03:23.345 --> 01:03:24.808
[SPEAKER_00]: I would probably give it to us.

01:03:24.868 --> 01:03:38.290
[SPEAKER_00]: I was about says going to I'd probably give it to usher only because the Kanye, the two Kanye albums that I think are better than call his dropout are the next two albums.

01:03:38.557 --> 01:03:39.218
[SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.

01:03:39.458 --> 01:03:39.759
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

01:03:39.779 --> 01:03:45.847
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I mean, you know, I'm not a, I'm not as big of a fan of the fourth album, which everyone believes.

01:03:45.887 --> 01:03:47.249
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a lot of people love that album.

01:03:47.269 --> 01:03:47.830
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

01:03:48.330 --> 01:03:49.352
[SPEAKER_00]: I, I don't give me the picker.

01:03:49.372 --> 01:03:50.914
[SPEAKER_00]: That, that, that, that gives me the pick.

01:03:51.635 --> 01:03:54.178
[SPEAKER_01]: But there's some problematic shit on that album.

01:03:54.999 --> 01:03:55.881
[SPEAKER_00]: Late graduation.

01:03:56.441 --> 01:03:59.085
[SPEAKER_00]: Was that, was that the album called late registration?

01:03:59.125 --> 01:03:59.325
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry.

01:03:59.365 --> 01:04:02.970
[SPEAKER_00]: Late registration is my favorite Kanye album.

01:04:02.990 --> 01:04:04.472
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, no doubt about it.

01:04:05.193 --> 01:04:06.555
[SPEAKER_00]: And then

01:04:08.290 --> 01:04:09.993
[SPEAKER_00]: What's the, what's the third album called?

01:04:10.013 --> 01:04:11.856
[SPEAKER_00]: Graduation, we should third one.

01:04:11.896 --> 01:04:13.638
[SPEAKER_00]: And like, I think that's a good album.

01:04:13.679 --> 01:04:16.763
[SPEAKER_00]: It may not be as in like as like, oh my gosh, who's this guy?

01:04:16.824 --> 01:04:20.950
[SPEAKER_00]: It's called a dropout, but I think that that album is really good as well.

01:04:21.491 --> 01:04:24.055
[SPEAKER_00]: So to me, I'm like,

01:04:24.490 --> 01:04:32.065
[SPEAKER_00]: Calls drop out is good, but if you listen to that version of Kanye, it's kind of very similar to what we talked about with Alicia Keys.

01:04:32.666 --> 01:04:46.212
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a clear, like, immaturity from a lyrical perspective that he does, he's never going to be, he was never going to be the greatest lyricist, but he definitely improves by the time those next two albums come out.

01:04:46.681 --> 01:04:47.082
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:04:47.102 --> 01:04:47.843
[SPEAKER_01]: You're probably right.

01:04:48.103 --> 01:05:00.504
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I just, you know, the first time I heard a college drop out, I just weren't being like, what the hell is this feeling like, you know, wow, like this is, this is a really interesting, like important piece of music.

01:05:01.326 --> 01:05:05.432
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, whenever a confession does just like, okay, this is a good R&B album.

01:05:05.452 --> 01:05:06.394
[SPEAKER_01]: And usher, I mean,

01:05:07.420 --> 01:05:08.501
[SPEAKER_01]: We already knew Usher was good.

01:05:10.443 --> 01:05:11.304
[SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know, man.

01:05:11.604 --> 01:05:13.766
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, I think all, I mean, shout out to Green Day too.

01:05:13.786 --> 01:05:15.348
[SPEAKER_01]: I think American idiot is a great record.

01:05:15.728 --> 01:05:17.530
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, all four of those albums are really good.

01:05:19.111 --> 01:05:23.055
[SPEAKER_01]: But obviously Ray Charles, they wanted to honor a legend.

01:05:23.776 --> 01:05:25.177
[SPEAKER_01]: He had recently passed away.

01:05:25.778 --> 01:05:28.080
[SPEAKER_01]: So Ray Charles ended up winning the award.

01:05:28.901 --> 01:05:30.662
[SPEAKER_00]: We're gonna do confessions at some point.

01:05:30.682 --> 01:05:36.668
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'll save most of my thesis statement on that album.

01:05:37.762 --> 01:05:51.130
[SPEAKER_00]: I think like my favorite usher song is actually what is the second the second first single and second album.

01:05:54.063 --> 01:05:56.026
[SPEAKER_00]: You remind me of a girl that I once knew.

01:05:56.266 --> 01:05:57.649
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, off, a seven or one.

01:05:57.669 --> 01:06:01.154
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, the first single was, yeah, you remind me.

01:06:01.194 --> 01:06:03.037
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's my favorite usher song of all time.

01:06:03.498 --> 01:06:03.999
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

01:06:04.019 --> 01:06:04.339
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

01:06:04.359 --> 01:06:07.164
[SPEAKER_00]: But I don't think it's his best album in any way.

01:06:07.845 --> 01:06:13.033
[SPEAKER_00]: And that the technically his second album, but the first album where people remember him.

01:06:13.013 --> 01:06:18.498
[SPEAKER_00]: like that was like who is this kid who who is like the video was amazing.

01:06:18.539 --> 01:06:24.044
[SPEAKER_00]: The right, you know, Germain Dupree's kind of got him doing some really cool stuff.

01:06:24.064 --> 01:06:28.549
[SPEAKER_00]: But by the time Confessions comes out, like he'd been in our lives a little bit.

01:06:28.649 --> 01:06:29.690
[SPEAKER_00]: We've seen him grow up.

01:06:30.430 --> 01:06:36.276
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was almost like he's like, okay, I'm going to take that teenage version that you know of me.

01:06:36.336 --> 01:06:39.640
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm going to put some adult shit out here.

01:06:39.720 --> 01:06:42.022
[SPEAKER_00]: Some of it is not great either.

01:06:42.222 --> 01:06:43.003
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's

01:06:44.030 --> 01:06:54.310
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, doing his usher, rockstar thing and basically telling us that he's doing this stuff and there was a little bit of a mistake in the song writing it was almost like

01:06:54.931 --> 01:06:55.972
[SPEAKER_00]: Did he really do this?

01:06:56.072 --> 01:06:56.894
[SPEAKER_00]: Is he telling on him?

01:06:57.094 --> 01:06:57.294
[SPEAKER_00]: What?

01:06:57.314 --> 01:06:58.395
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, what's going on there?

01:06:58.596 --> 01:07:04.043
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, and a big part of why that album was so successful because it was this whole drama around it.

01:07:04.083 --> 01:07:06.686
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, his usher did usher cheat on Chile.

01:07:07.267 --> 01:07:09.850
[SPEAKER_01]: And is this why this song came up, blah, blah, blah.

01:07:09.870 --> 01:07:15.037
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it comes out much later that, you know, a lot of those songs are really based on germane-to-preas life and not usher's life.

01:07:15.237 --> 01:07:15.438
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:07:15.778 --> 01:07:21.225
[SPEAKER_00]: So I just thought the mystique and the, like, because like the people,

01:07:21.982 --> 01:07:24.424
[SPEAKER_00]: voted with their at the cash register, right?

01:07:24.444 --> 01:07:29.289
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that was a giant album and album is a diamond certified record.

01:07:29.309 --> 01:07:30.330
[SPEAKER_00]: So all right.

01:07:31.531 --> 01:07:39.839
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's let's get a little bit more on diary and then we'll end this album or end this episode.

01:07:39.919 --> 01:07:50.790
[SPEAKER_00]: So here's some trivia now, you know, like I said, like I always say with this internet stuff, who knows what's what, but I'll put it out there and we can believe what we want to

01:07:50.905 --> 01:08:05.565
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm glad in you don't know my name, Alicia recites a phone number and for years fans called it and heard a recorded message from her now I will say that part of that song if you don't know my name.

01:08:07.868 --> 01:08:11.513
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that part I think that song is corny so it's not my

01:08:12.691 --> 01:08:20.560
[SPEAKER_00]: Especially when she's like leaving the voicemail and she's talking about how you know She's not in when she can doll herself up a little bit.

01:08:20.580 --> 01:08:31.594
[SPEAKER_00]: She's not in her work clothes and she's leaving You know, she doesn't really do this thing, but I think you're kind of fly like that part of the song I'm like, okay, can I just fast forward like I think that's you.

01:08:31.614 --> 01:08:34.998
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey Siri can you fast forward 15 seconds?

01:08:36.560 --> 01:08:41.145
[SPEAKER_00]: But it works because it was such a big part of the video

01:08:41.125 --> 01:08:47.092
[SPEAKER_00]: And so that's why, you know, I don't know, that's a part of this song, where she says her phone is breaking up.

01:08:47.613 --> 01:08:48.393
[SPEAKER_01]: I, yeah.

01:08:48.734 --> 01:09:03.471
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, but if you think about listening to songs on the radio or in your car, if you're singing with the song, and then you got to stop singing because she's talking.

01:09:03.586 --> 01:09:11.882
[SPEAKER_01]: that's kind of like a retro thing because there were a lot of songs in the 70s that would have like a little spoken period to where somebody was talking to somebody on the phone or whatever.

01:09:11.922 --> 01:09:14.967
[SPEAKER_01]: So I get what she was trying to do.

01:09:15.268 --> 01:09:16.029
[SPEAKER_01]: It I don't know.

01:09:16.050 --> 01:09:16.731
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's cute.

01:09:17.693 --> 01:09:20.618
[SPEAKER_01]: And it did match well with the video.

01:09:20.939 --> 01:09:25.047
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember her reciting a phone number in the song, but I think there was a phone number in the video.

01:09:25.067 --> 01:09:25.928
[SPEAKER_00]: No, maybe that sort of was.

01:09:26.269 --> 01:09:26.910
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:09:27.582 --> 01:09:50.215
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, Alicia wrote the basis of the song diary in just 10 minutes after a deep conversation on the road with who with what where was she doing this is why this internet research stuff is a little it's you know, I don't really like that's a nice little thing but give me some more.

01:09:50.684 --> 01:09:56.756
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's also that song has Tony Tony Tony, but there's not have Rock the L. So to be that's not that's Tony Tony.

01:09:56.776 --> 01:09:56.996
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:09:57.156 --> 01:09:58.399
[SPEAKER_01]: That's not Tony Tony Tony.

01:09:58.439 --> 01:09:58.639
[SPEAKER_01]: No.

01:09:59.020 --> 01:09:59.240
[SPEAKER_01]: No.

01:10:01.164 --> 01:10:02.707
[SPEAKER_00]: Kanye West produced.

01:10:02.727 --> 01:10:10.482
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't know my name shortly after his famous car accident and reportedly showed up in the studio with his jaw still wired shut.

01:10:12.402 --> 01:10:21.400
[SPEAKER_01]: possible I guess the funer fact is that the instrumental piece where she's

01:10:22.544 --> 01:10:31.156
[SPEAKER_01]: on the phone, talking to, you know, whatever dude, Kanye recycled that and used it on comfortable by little Wayne and babyface.

01:10:31.177 --> 01:10:31.317
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh.

01:10:32.418 --> 01:10:37.025
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, actually, it's not the part where she's talking but it's the very, it's the end of the song.

01:10:37.185 --> 01:10:41.612
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, he sampled that and it's the basis of that little Wayne song.

01:10:41.772 --> 01:10:42.914
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if I've heard that song.

01:10:43.735 --> 01:10:45.077
[SPEAKER_01]: It's, I mean, baby faces on it.

01:10:45.097 --> 01:10:49.463
[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually, it is the one little Wayne song that I will actually go on record

01:10:51.147 --> 01:10:53.331
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, six foot seven.

01:10:53.371 --> 01:10:54.753
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not down with six foot seven.

01:10:55.474 --> 01:10:57.577
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's a quick fair.

01:10:57.858 --> 01:11:02.245
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, this two little songs that I like.

01:11:02.385 --> 01:11:06.632
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember, um, I've conversation with a buddy who is actually a school teacher.

01:11:07.914 --> 01:11:09.797
[SPEAKER_00]: And he, he was like,

01:11:10.030 --> 01:11:13.617
[SPEAKER_00]: little Wayne is such a great lyricist.

01:11:14.298 --> 01:11:25.340
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like, and I'm a school teacher, so I appreciate like, you know, when the songwriting and stuff, and he and I would argue and argue and argue is like, nope, he's not the one, man.

01:11:25.560 --> 01:11:31.011
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like, nope, this is why, this is why our education system is where it is.

01:11:31.031 --> 01:11:32.494
[SPEAKER_00]: He was just a big little Wayne Finn.

01:11:32.643 --> 01:11:34.870
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, I can't, I can't, I don't see that guy.

01:11:34.911 --> 01:11:40.569
[SPEAKER_00]: I just always see that little kid from back in the day who was with those, those other dudes.

01:11:40.609 --> 01:11:41.272
[SPEAKER_00]: That's how I see that.

01:11:41.292 --> 01:11:42.014
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at the hot boys.

01:11:42.054 --> 01:11:42.757
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, with the hot boys.

01:11:42.777 --> 01:11:42.917
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:11:43.619 --> 01:11:44.683
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, all right.

01:11:44.723 --> 01:11:45.606
[SPEAKER_00]: So.

01:11:45.721 --> 01:11:50.510
[SPEAKER_00]: I was looking through, you know, I listened through the album again, I didn't listen to it in a while.

01:11:51.632 --> 01:12:00.608
[SPEAKER_00]: And as we talk about our no-skips rating, the thing that stands out most to me is how front-loaded the album is.

01:12:01.289 --> 01:12:07.300
[SPEAKER_00]: All the singles, all the songs you remember, they're all in the beginning the first half of the album.

01:12:07.320 --> 01:12:10.345
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the second half was like, I literally don't know,

01:12:10.325 --> 01:12:30.929
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I'm sure I've heard it before, but like my brain didn't remember the song, so from that perspective, I don't know that I could give it as high of a rating as some of the others because of that because it but if you split it in half, I think the first half is like a nine or a ten, it's just the second half that I don't really pay attention to.

01:12:31.930 --> 01:12:33.312
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean.

01:12:33.798 --> 01:12:43.410
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm actually like, I can remember my opinions review of this album somewhat and this album kind of falls off a cliff halfway through.

01:12:43.450 --> 01:12:55.065
[SPEAKER_01]: The lyrics kind of get kind of not great, you know, Alicia Keys is sometimes the lyrics of her songs are really like kind of cringy.

01:12:56.287 --> 01:13:00.632
[SPEAKER_01]: They're very like simple and you know, I think you're kind of fly.

01:13:00.612 --> 01:13:15.166
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, sorry, so the first like first seven songs, first seven or eight songs on the album adopt and then like the back half of the album is kind of like, but the first couple of the first few songs are so strong.

01:13:15.227 --> 01:13:18.690
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep, you know, I would probably give it like a seven.

01:13:19.170 --> 01:13:28.780
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a seven in a seven plus depending on how strong you believe that first half of the album is great.

01:13:29.047 --> 01:13:51.831
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so we're going to do our top five and we'll put that out as the next episode and just a little bit of a preview I'm going to have a little bit of a rock with it stop with it with Mike and most of those songs that are in the rock with it are completely open to be in the top five.

01:13:51.811 --> 01:14:06.904
[SPEAKER_00]: But are more of the songs that are kind of outside of her albums necessarily, though there are two actually no three that are on the unplugged album, which I really like that unplugged album.

01:14:07.706 --> 01:14:11.254
[SPEAKER_00]: And I have this theory that

01:14:12.803 --> 01:14:23.046
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm kind of interested in what you think about it because do you call it do you think those albums should be qualified more as like greatest hits albums or do they because like if you were to listen to.

01:14:24.951 --> 01:14:27.176
[SPEAKER_00]: Now my favorite album my favorite Jay Z album.

01:14:28.739 --> 01:14:31.285
[SPEAKER_00]: If it was just his discography.

01:14:31.501 --> 01:14:32.683
[SPEAKER_00]: It's probably the black album.

01:14:32.923 --> 01:14:50.269
[SPEAKER_00]: It may be reasonable doubt depending on kind of what the mood I'm in if I want to go back, but it's one of those two now blueprint is great, but I think there's some filler on blueprint, but if I want to get the best of jazzy, I will listen to the unplugged album hit that unplugged because

01:14:51.177 --> 01:14:52.502
[SPEAKER_00]: We got the roots back there.

01:14:52.542 --> 01:14:54.067
[SPEAKER_00]: We got Jaguar right back there.

01:14:54.288 --> 01:15:00.148
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think they give a dynamic that is missing maybe on some of those songs when they were normally produced.

01:15:00.951 --> 01:15:02.115
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:15:02.264 --> 01:15:12.673
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, if I was to rank the albums as I listened to them, Alicia's unplugged album might be my third go to after the first two.

01:15:12.793 --> 01:15:21.221
[SPEAKER_00]: I might just skip everything else and go, I just want to listen to the unplugged album, which is only features the first two albums and then, you know, some other stuff that she did.

01:15:21.661 --> 01:15:28.508
[SPEAKER_00]: So, right, that's kind of where I am with unplugged, and I think, well, but where are you from like that live album perspective?

01:15:28.528 --> 01:15:32.271
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, we talked with Jackson's live album from that from that tour.

01:15:32.251 --> 01:15:34.878
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's not a studio record, right?

01:15:35.038 --> 01:15:42.717
[SPEAKER_01]: It's something different, but I think Alicia's albums have so much filler that

01:15:44.333 --> 01:15:59.748
[SPEAKER_01]: kind of the best way to enjoy her music in one cohesive way, if you're not just making your own playlists on your streaming service of choice, which is what we're gonna end up doing at some point is to listen to that unplugged album.

01:15:59.768 --> 01:16:07.336
[SPEAKER_01]: Because, you know, the live versions are not dramatically different from the studio versions, and you're kind of getting all the hits in one place.

01:16:08.016 --> 01:16:13.682
[SPEAKER_00]: She doesn't actually have a great sits album and we talked about this with Bruno Mars.

01:16:14.725 --> 01:16:22.200
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there's no need for anybody to have a greatest hits album anymore just because, uh, you know, people can make their own playlists.

01:16:22.220 --> 01:16:27.530
[SPEAKER_01]: There is there was and shout out to my homeboy Mike to cat and his site the second disc.

01:16:28.011 --> 01:16:30.697
[SPEAKER_01]: There was a greatest hits album released overseas.

01:16:30.997 --> 01:16:31.338
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

01:16:31.358 --> 01:16:34.043
[SPEAKER_01]: Last last last year is a matter of fact.

01:16:35.045 --> 01:16:35.907
[SPEAKER_01]: Um.

01:16:35.887 --> 01:16:40.004
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, it doesn't exist in the US.

01:16:40.606 --> 01:16:43.297
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it might be like Japanese only or something like that.

01:16:43.317 --> 01:16:46.470
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking at it on eBay right now.

01:16:47.362 --> 01:16:52.772
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, again, like you have streaming services, there is whatever Spotify does.

01:16:52.852 --> 01:16:54.596
[SPEAKER_01]: This is Alicia Keys or whatever it is.

01:16:55.096 --> 01:16:59.344
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, Apple Music will have the essential I don't like right.

01:16:59.364 --> 01:17:01.448
[SPEAKER_00]: I could have made a better essentials playlist.

01:17:01.468 --> 01:17:04.694
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I could make a better essentials playlist for any artists.

01:17:05.175 --> 01:17:07.159
[SPEAKER_01]: The, you know, there's like,

01:17:08.084 --> 01:17:17.706
[SPEAKER_00]: There were some interesting additions that I was like, nope, there's like seven, she has like seven or eight songs better than this one, you know, these last two that you put on there so.

01:17:17.753 --> 01:17:18.093
[SPEAKER_01]: Great.

01:17:18.574 --> 01:17:34.112
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so we'll be back with the top five with Alicia Keys and then that'll be it for our episodes on Alicia, but as Mike said, he will have a playlist up and we'll put that up on 50 for 50.net.

01:17:34.673 --> 01:17:36.435
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, that is it from here.

01:17:37.256 --> 01:17:39.558
[SPEAKER_00]: For Mike, I'm WGC when we see you piece out.

01:17:40.159 --> 01:17:40.960
[SPEAKER_00]: Ready, all?