Faith & the George Michael Story: A Full Career Deep Dive

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[SPEAKER_01]: It is the year 1987.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We are 13 away.

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[SPEAKER_01]: When does album come out?

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[SPEAKER_00]: No, oh no, we're 11 11.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What when does album come out?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's end in 1987.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're definitely 11.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So 11 years old, were you previously aware of wham because of the music or because of like the magazine covers and such?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't remember too much in terms of like magazine covers, but I mean, I knew the music I had like their tapes and stuff.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So I was very much a fan.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Did they get a lot of radio play?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, they were huge.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, maybe not initially, but I would say like 84 85s.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They were probably one of the biggest biggest bands out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't really remember listening to them until a little while later, but I do remember like the teen pop magazine stuff and wondering who those dudes were.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're interesting.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, like I knew of them.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Before I feel like most people did just because I think there was like a local video show that played one of the early videos and I was like, who are these guys?

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[SPEAKER_00]: But then like wake me up before you go go came out maybe like a year later and that was a huge hit.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, then it was like okay well now everybody knows who these dudes are.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So if you didn't guess we are talking about George Michael and his album Faith

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[SPEAKER_01]: is going to be the album that we do the entire episode around.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And let's dig into the year that was 1987, some pretty interesting things that happened.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: January 3rd, Reeth of Franklin becomes the first woman inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in the U.S. Other inductees of this year, the coasters Eddie Cochrane, Bo Didley Marvin Gaye Bill, Hayley Clyde McFadder, Ricky Nelson Roy Orbison Carl Perkins, Smokey Robinson and Jackie Wilson.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, that was, I think maybe like the second year that the Rock and the Hall of Fame was even in existence.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, shout out to Rita.

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[SPEAKER_01]: February 14th, Bon Jovies, living on a prayer reaches number one in the U.S.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It would be 87's biggest hit song worldwide.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's like the White People National Anthem.

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[SPEAKER_01]: February 24th, the 29th annual Grammys in LA hosted by Billy Crystal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Paul Simon's Grace Lin wins out of the year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Stevie Winwood's higher love wins record of the year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Dion Warwick's cover of that's what friends are for.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Featuring Elton John, Gladys Knight, Stevie Wonder wins song of the year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And Bruce Horn's being the range wins best new artist.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's a very unseasoned Grammy Awards.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, what you, I feel, I, I don't know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think higher love still holds up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, higher love is a great song.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and look, I love Bruce Hornsby too, um, but yeah, I mean, that was, you know, 1986 was near Janet, and I remember she performed on that show, and it was a great performance.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You can go on YouTube and look it up, um, but she didn't win anything.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So that was sad.

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[SPEAKER_01]: March 9th, YouTube releases the Joshua tree and album that launches them into Superstar status.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The album would sell 14 million copies in 87 alone and it would win Grammy for album of the year the following year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What is your relationship with YouTube in 1987?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there really isn't one.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I'd heard of YouTube prior.

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[SPEAKER_00]: to 1987, so to me, they were a new band.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Again, I was 10 or 11 years old, and certainly not the target demographic for YouTube's music at the time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'd become much more familiar with them in high school, but yeah, I mean, that was my initial, like I didn't know who YouTube or what YouTube was prior to that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Carol King, Sue's the owner of a record company, Lou Adler claiming that she is owed more than $400,000 in royalties.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She also asks for rights to her old recordings.

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[SPEAKER_01]: $400,000 on a lot of money.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Is it a lot of money?

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I did 87.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I feel like most people who sue the record company are sue them for like millions and millions of dollars.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, George would sue later.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, indeed he would.

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[SPEAKER_01]: To get out of the contract.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Did Carol King win her money?

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, and then there was no update.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, I hope she did.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She did do.

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[SPEAKER_01]: June 27th, Whitney Houston's second album Whitney becomes the first album by female artists

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[SPEAKER_01]: Big deal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: July 21st.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Guns and roses release appetite for destruction, which after initial slow sales will become the best selling debut album of all time with more than 18 million copies sold in the US alone to date.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm responsible for two or three of those.

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[SPEAKER_01]: August 31st, MJ releases bad his first album since thriller.

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[SPEAKER_01]: uh... the outlet produced five number one singles in the u.s. a record which has not been broken.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and an album that i think michael was kind of unsatisfied with because the whole mentality was as has to be thriller and it's like dude like the thing is this thing is still huge there's no i mean you know uh... we've talked about this and i'm sure we'll talk about it again it's like how do you even

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[SPEAKER_00]: You can't do that, like thriller, it didn't sell all of those millions of copies just because it was a good album.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like, there are other factors that play into that and you can't, you can't like deliberately replicate that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So, bad, I mean, I don't think bad is as good an album as thriller is, but bad could have theoretically been five times better than thriller and still probably wouldn't this old as much.

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[SPEAKER_01]: faith and bad.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that they're like similar albums, but I feel like like Michael could have sang a lot of songs on faith and George could have sung a lot of songs on bad and they could have just like flip flopped them.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, they're very much like 1987 pop albums and I, you know, I do think that there was back in the day some talk about the two of them doing a record together, which I think would have been fantastic, but it never happened.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The speaking of that, I have a new category for us, which is dream collaborations could be production style or just artists clapping.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I'll ask you that later, because as I was listening to a lot of faith, I was like, man, I wanted to hear him do songs with this person and this person.

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[SPEAKER_01]: OK, October 30th, George Michael releases Faith, which would win the Grammy Award for album of the year and sell 11 million copies in the U.S. alone.

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[SPEAKER_01]: November 13th, Sunday and share reunite for performance on late night with David Letterman.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then, on the 19th, share returns to music after five years of absence, she was in actress.

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[SPEAKER_01]: When the lead single of her second self-title album, second self-titled album, that's when you know your, your big is when you can have more than one self-title album.

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[SPEAKER_01]: That says your name and peaked at number five in the UK and number ten in the US.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Do you know that I saw a live, uh,

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[SPEAKER_01]: Broadway show, not it's not Broadway, obviously, in the Bay Area.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We call it San Jose Broadway.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There is a share musical out there is, which is kind of fun.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It was, I had a good time with it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What's it called?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Share lie, I don't know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe the third self titled share.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But basically it takes like the three different actresses play like three different versions of share like the sunny and share version and then when she starts doing the acting and then when she comes back for, you know, her the post part of her career and I don't know how old this woman is, but she has like a 25 year old boyfriend right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She's got to share 70s or something share might be 80 at this point.

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[SPEAKER_00]: elderly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to use the wrong like word.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Um, she is, she is an aged woman, uh, shares 80 years old.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So good for you, share.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Also, I feel like share, prints and Howard Stern's fartman.

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[SPEAKER_01]: were icons for letting the ash cheats hang out a little bit in there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's a whole, you know, I remember that share video being like a scandal.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's crazy, because now everybody walks around with their ash cheats.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, very tame compared to today.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Share was a trend center.

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[SPEAKER_01]: December 31st, the 16th annual New Year's Rock and Eve special.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And the reason I pulled this one out is because of some of the artists that

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[SPEAKER_01]: Man, well, what, what a time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Lisa Lisa and the cult jam, Los Lobos, and if you remember 1987, that was a bomba baby.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The bomba came out and they did the soundtrack, or they did all the rich yvall and songs on the soundtrack.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Barry Manalo, of course.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Restless heart and the temptations.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think I might have watched New Year's Rock and even that year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: which one do you which performance did you remember that made I mean I think probably Lisa Lisa and I think everybody you know every kid of color in 1987 was jock and Lisa Lisa did we talk about this in our two pockets I don't remember but Lisa's like yeah two pocket it I mean

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, again, like if you're from that era, like Lisa Lisa was, you know, like number one stunner back in those days.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so I'm not fully surprised.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, two that would have been someone that too pop could have been man if I could just hang out with Lisa.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: All right, let's talk about George Michael here.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Is it me or do other people always want to put an S at the end of his name?

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I have to like physically stop myself.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I say, I always thought that was a black people thing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like they would, you know, we say Donna Summers instead of Donna S. Exactly, Donna Summers as well for some reason.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I always want to put the S.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So George Michael was born.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know how to pronounce his name.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I can pronounce it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He's a real name is your ghost, Kiriako Spanioto.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, there you go.

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[SPEAKER_01]: June 25, 1963 in North London, youngest of three kids in a family of English and Greek heritage.

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[SPEAKER_01]: uh... he was a shy overweight kid and uh... young man by the name of andrew richly kind of a friend at him and took him under his wing and they hit it off and they stayed homies for for the rest of uh... George's life yes indeed their first band together though was not wham in nineteen eighty nineteen seventy nine

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[SPEAKER_01]: They, along with Andrew's brother Paul and some other friends, David Austin and Andrew Leaver, formed a five-piece scab and called the executive.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We heard an eight executive tracks before.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think those have made it to the internet.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So two years later, they stripped down the concept to just two of them, and that's how WAM became WAM.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So the backstory of wham is they just were making songs and trying to get some attention.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think a part of, we mentioned that lawsuit, part of George's frustration with that lawsuit is that he said when he and Andrew were creating demos, the record label basically held them hostage and were like, you signed with us now because if you don't, then you lose all those demos too, that you just made.

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[SPEAKER_01]: predatory.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, that's, you know, welcome to the record industry, you know, rural number of 4,080.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Their debut album Fantastic in 1983 hit number one on the UK album charts make it big, topped both the UK and the US charts the next year powered by what Mike mentioned.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Wake me up before you go go their first US number one and careless whisper

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[SPEAKER_01]: was Bill does a George single, though, I think still, it was like a wham featuring George or something at that time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and the UK, it was released as a George Michael solo single in the US.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Nobody knew who wham was, really.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That first album did not do well over here, and they didn't want to put a solo single out and confuse people, so it came out as wham featuring George Michael.

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[SPEAKER_01]: 1985, they became the first Western pop act to tour China, and the partnership then kind of got a little stale because George was the primary songwriter, producer, and creative engine, and by 86, he wanted to shed.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The bubblegum go-go image and go for something more adult.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and wham split up later that year, closing out with the final, a sold-out farewell concert at Wembley in front of 72,000 fans with Elton John among surprise guests.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I was watching there's a wham documentary on Netflix.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Now, I think Andrew's mother was kind of the person who put a lot of the stuff together.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She had a lot of the clips and the footage and the photos and such.

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[SPEAKER_01]: you're amazing, like you got to do you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he had a free ride, basically.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I was thinking about this this morning.

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[SPEAKER_00]: George was this grown-up was this shy, overweight, closeted kid, some of an immigrant, unpronounceable name like all this stuff.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He basically absorbed Andrew's personality,

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[SPEAKER_00]: became a star like using Andrew's personality and kind of brought Andrew along for part of the ride, probably out of a sense of like I'm swaggerjack in this guy like I need to at least let him you know, I think part of it was like I can't do this without him and then once he gained the confidence to be fully out on his own he's like look man, let's you know have a parting of the ways but it is a really interesting dynamic because it you know

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[SPEAKER_00]: You look at other duos and obviously like one guy does more than the other guy, but the other guy still does something, right, right, whereas with when it was kind of like George did everything and Andrew was kind of just there to like the I can't be, I don't know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, so I mean, I'd like that part of the story, you know, Andrew Ridgley becomes a bit of like a a trivia question, you know, once George becomes super famous, but like that friendship, you know, the having.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like having your homies back and it's been like you're you're amazing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You got it, you know, you going so low doesn't do anything.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it doesn't harm me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I'm sure he was not happy with not making the money, but like I mean, I think he was pretty well set up and he was like, look, you know, when your home boy takes you on a ride and you don't have to work another day in your life because of that you're good to go.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So faith is the album that is the first album where, you know, like you said, it fits right in 1987.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's not something that had listened to in full in a very long time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I did, I just was like, man, I was kind of put back in that time frame of the late 80s, which, you know, as a kid, is probably the most memorable time of my childhood, because

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[SPEAKER_01]: There was just so many things and like my sports fandom and my pop culture fandom and we've talked about our Sineo Hall and being like that becoming kind of our, uh, at least for me, our Sineo Hall was also that link to what was going on in the world because of his monologue.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He talking about.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's talking about politics and different things.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, it's a very memorable time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I would say from 87 to like 92, there's like a five-year period where I'm just like so in tune with music and TV and the just like just really understanding like this zeitgeist of things.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, this is, it just took me back to that time frame.

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[SPEAKER_00]: How did you find out about George Michael?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like what was your uh, like entry point?

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think I would say like I wasn't really aware of wham outside of some of the very popular songs.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like I didn't even they were not really someone that I was like, oh, I got to go search and find that and listen to that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, oh, it's a sigh here this song on the radio everyone's in a while and it seemed to like it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But when I want your sex came out,

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[SPEAKER_01]: That, I don't know what the MTV rotation was like, but I felt like I saw that a lot.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, the thing, the thing that I find really compelling about his story is like, if you think of 87, and if you think of what faith did, like he is standing,

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[SPEAKER_01]: Prince and he's not blinking, not just like I'm I'm up here with you guys now and like he've just fits.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean when you think about that era of like the late 80s, he was, you know, he was as big as it got.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, um, I mean, arguably at that time, probably bigger than Prince or Madonna, um, it was, you know, Michael and then it was kind, you know, Michael and Whitney and kind of like George Michael and that was kind of like the top of the top right there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, cultural impact, he sold more than 100 million records worldwide across WAM and his solo career.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Faith alone sold over 25 million copies of certified diamond.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He was the first white solo artist to top Billboard's Black album's chart as well.

20:20.472 --> 20:22.894
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, there was...

20:24.811 --> 20:36.080
[SPEAKER_01]: a word show where he won for R&B and I know a lot of people were kind of outspoken about whether or not he should have been allowed to win that award.

20:36.360 --> 20:36.580
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

20:37.080 --> 20:43.706
[SPEAKER_01]: I think Gladys Knight I saw in one of the documentaries that I watched where she had a statement around it.

20:43.766 --> 20:44.927
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you remember that time frame?

20:45.287 --> 20:49.290
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, they, like, the Gladys Knight said something about it.

20:49.830 --> 20:56.355
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a version of public enemies fight the power where flavorflaves says something about George Michael winning in an R&B category.

20:56.856 --> 21:01.939
[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, the reality is this first of all George Michael had a huge R&B audience.

21:02.039 --> 21:08.965
[SPEAKER_00]: He is very much a singer in the R&B tradition, but the American musical words is voted on by the public.

21:10.005 --> 21:15.510
[SPEAKER_00]: And the public is people in middle America who would just see names and they're like, oh, that's the same.

21:15.530 --> 21:16.851
[SPEAKER_00]: I recognize I'm going to check it off.

21:17.691 --> 21:21.074
[SPEAKER_00]: And at that point, everybody in America knew who George Michael was.

21:21.454 --> 21:22.956
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I mean, it wasn't

21:23.917 --> 21:39.045
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't necessarily based on talent, even though I think George Michael is certainly more talented singer or songwriter than, you know, somebody like Bobby Brown, who's also like popping around that time, but.

21:39.705 --> 21:50.414
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I think if you understand how the awards are tabulated, um, and, you know, the reality, again, is that George Michael was very popular with R&B audiences.

21:50.474 --> 21:52.556
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, faith was a number one R&B album.

21:52.636 --> 21:54.637
[SPEAKER_00]: One more try was a number one R&B single.

21:54.677 --> 21:57.660
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he, you know, he had the bona fides.

21:58.501 --> 22:05.146
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's just kind of like, I certainly get why, you know, black artists were complaining,

22:09.199 --> 22:13.502
[SPEAKER_00]: the industry was not set up necessarily for black artists to win.

22:14.202 --> 22:20.585
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, when not in terms of awards, but just win in general.

22:20.645 --> 22:27.949
[SPEAKER_00]: So I get why there was the controversy about it, but also think, you know, I'm not mad at him winning those awards.

22:28.269 --> 22:30.310
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he was, he was the ship.

22:31.822 --> 22:43.629
[SPEAKER_01]: going back to your question about when, you know, when I would have become aware of him and a fan, it wouldn't be until the second album where I really latched on to him.

22:46.170 --> 22:49.212
[SPEAKER_01]: And we'll get to this, especially when it comes to our top five.

22:49.832 --> 22:55.756
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's that freedom 90 music video, right, which is like one of my favorite music videos of all time.

22:55.776 --> 23:01.339
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it was I didn't have MTV at that time my assumption is that it was all over MTV.

23:01.859 --> 23:06.542
[SPEAKER_01]: It was all over and he's not even really in it.

23:06.882 --> 23:10.324
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't even know if he's not he's not in it at all.

23:10.745 --> 23:14.427
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you have all of these really pretty people, these super models,

23:19.530 --> 23:36.525
[SPEAKER_01]: Is the director just shot incredibly creatively well and like so many iconic moments just in that video alone yeah, I mean that would have been where I would like where I if I think of like when was I the biggest fan of his it would have been that time frame.

23:36.885 --> 23:51.634
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, you've got Cindy Crawford, and now we Campbell, I don't remember who else was in that video, but you know, it was a bunch of super models and I mean to backtrack even further George Michael was the first white dude I ever heard rap.

23:51.774 --> 23:53.195
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, we're we're going to get to that.

23:53.615 --> 23:57.017
[SPEAKER_01]: So Christy Turling 10 Linda Evangelista.

23:57.097 --> 23:57.478
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

23:57.558 --> 24:01.640
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we're going to we're going to get to rap for sure.

24:01.840 --> 24:02.180
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

24:08.037 --> 24:21.726
[SPEAKER_01]: the album journey here, so, if you think about when he actually came out and then you think about his output, it was not a lot, nope.

24:22.744 --> 24:28.827
[SPEAKER_01]: 1987, faith, the debut solo album written and produced almost entirely by himself.

24:29.988 --> 24:40.873
[SPEAKER_01]: Six top five U.S. singles, four number ones, Grammy album in the year, like we said, listen without prejudice, volume one, and that title itself is kind of a statement on him winning

24:45.978 --> 24:55.345
[SPEAKER_01]: he refused to appear in most of the videos or tour heavily wanting the music not his face to carry the record includes prank for time and freedom 90.

24:56.285 --> 25:09.534
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it's not until six years later, where older comes out a darker jazz and soul album written in the shadow of his partners passing from

25:11.095 --> 25:11.976
[SPEAKER_01]: HIV and AIDS.

25:12.316 --> 25:12.556
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

25:13.457 --> 25:18.119
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's it's the first album after the Sony lawsuit.

25:18.299 --> 25:20.200
[SPEAKER_01]: And what is the story of that lawsuit?

25:20.220 --> 25:22.362
[SPEAKER_01]: So he wants to get out.

25:22.662 --> 25:23.582
[SPEAKER_01]: He takes him to court.

25:23.642 --> 25:24.443
[SPEAKER_01]: He loses.

25:24.463 --> 25:25.443
[SPEAKER_01]: He loses the case.

25:25.643 --> 25:29.866
[SPEAKER_01]: And then Gethon buys his contract out from Sony.

25:30.066 --> 25:30.466
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that what?

25:30.486 --> 25:31.066
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

25:31.086 --> 25:31.907
[SPEAKER_00]: So yes.

25:32.167 --> 25:33.348
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, essentially,

25:34.388 --> 25:54.944
[SPEAKER_00]: He said that he was never going to record again, as long as he was on a contract to Sony, and at some point, DreamWorks, which was this huge merger of like Spielberg and Gethin, and I think Jeffrey Katzenberg created a music label, and they bought George out of his contracts.

25:55.946 --> 26:02.899
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, older came out on DreamWorks, you know, and then eventually George went back to Sony.

26:04.401 --> 26:07.647
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I mean, that was sort of how that album came to be.

26:10.080 --> 26:14.701
[SPEAKER_01]: And then songs of the last century, 1999, covers album.

26:16.242 --> 26:19.883
[SPEAKER_01]: And then patients, 2004, was this final studio album.

26:20.863 --> 26:23.764
[SPEAKER_01]: And that is 12 years before his passing.

26:24.404 --> 26:25.565
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he died in 2016.

26:25.585 --> 26:25.945
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, just,

26:30.975 --> 26:45.897
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, for a guy who had that the writing chops and the creativity, it's just it's crazy that he didn't have more albums and and not one, you know, past to and is I guess he would have been in his 30s by that 2004 album.

26:47.723 --> 26:49.044
[SPEAKER_00]: Ah, he would have just turned 40.

26:49.104 --> 26:52.005
[SPEAKER_00]: He would have gotten, yeah, yeah.

26:52.105 --> 26:55.167
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's crazy, and it's tragic, and it's sad.

26:55.227 --> 27:04.591
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that the trauma that he endured is largely what prevented him from making more music.

27:06.152 --> 27:07.033
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, there were a lot of,

27:08.013 --> 27:24.185
[SPEAKER_00]: albums that were supposed to be made and never got made there was like a duet album that he was supposed to do at some point with like all of these different artists and that never came out and I just think he you know he got in his own way a lot and

27:25.687 --> 27:40.181
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I don't say that to be like critical of him, I think he went through a lot, you know, particularly like, you know, you lose your partner before you turn 30 and, you know, you also are a gay man.

27:42.203 --> 27:58.823
[SPEAKER_00]: who is like the biggest star in the planet and you have to like do all this shit to hide your sexuality right um because you know it was the 80s and the 90s and nobody was out like it just it like it takes a toll on you and I think you know the emotional toll of all of that just kind of like broken.

28:00.218 --> 28:11.403
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, what's interesting is his public persona made it seem like he just took everything and tried and he would even make fun of himself a little bit.

28:11.963 --> 28:19.186
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's the moment where is it is it a rest stop where the undercover cop just kind of sets him up.

28:19.546 --> 28:23.948
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it was like a park with, you know, it was a park with the public restroom, okay.

28:24.708 --> 28:29.452
[SPEAKER_01]: So he gets set up, and then he exposes himself, and then he gets arrested.

28:29.752 --> 28:32.074
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, what was the reason for the setup?

28:32.154 --> 28:35.617
[SPEAKER_01]: If what they weren't trying to set him up, they were just trying to set up gay men?

28:36.398 --> 28:51.331
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I mean, you know, there is, you know, a long and wide history of, you know, men who we're looking for sex with men, to meet up in public places and cruise, public parks.

28:53.092 --> 28:55.173
[SPEAKER_00]: were very notorious for this.

28:55.533 --> 29:03.818
[SPEAKER_00]: So the place where George got arrested was a pretty widely known cruising area for, you know, men looking to have sex with men.

29:04.658 --> 29:08.620
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, it was just kind of a sting operation, basically, and George got caught in it.

29:09.761 --> 29:09.861
[SPEAKER_01]: And

29:10.822 --> 29:21.508
[SPEAKER_01]: that whole scenario is the emphasis on the song outside, which is his public coming out party, I guess.

29:21.568 --> 29:24.189
[SPEAKER_01]: And even the video, he's in like a police uniform.

29:24.209 --> 29:26.831
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, using that for creativeness.

29:27.751 --> 29:32.914
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, like, I can't, I'm trying to remember, but,

29:36.402 --> 29:41.025
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think I ever really thought he was heterosexual.

29:41.145 --> 29:43.426
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, lots of people did for the most part.

29:43.446 --> 29:49.830
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I'm sure when I was younger, like, I didn't even think about it, but as I got a little older, I was like, hmm, okay, like I get it.

29:49.910 --> 30:00.757
[SPEAKER_01]: Like he's, you know, his, the way he dresses and the way he looks, I go, you know, I mean, he has to hide this for whatever reason, but the culture, the society that we live in.

30:01.097 --> 30:03.839
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but when he did finally come out,

30:06.742 --> 30:13.064
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad that you are finally able to do this for yourself, because so many people had talked about him as hiding that.

30:13.444 --> 30:19.325
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and it's really strange, you know, because his biggest fan base was women.

30:21.286 --> 30:25.147
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think, unlike, like you think about him and then you think about Luther, right?

30:26.147 --> 30:31.769
[SPEAKER_00]: And there were gay rumors about both of those artists for a really, really long period of time.

30:32.628 --> 30:38.210
[SPEAKER_00]: And with Luther, I don't know that many of his fans like had a crush on him.

30:38.230 --> 30:45.151
[SPEAKER_00]: I think there was just an identification that people couldn't name at the time.

30:45.611 --> 30:50.473
[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas with George, like, there were a lot of women that saw him as like a sex symbol.

30:50.513 --> 30:52.873
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, there were women that wanted to go to bed with him.

30:53.394 --> 31:01.616
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think the, you know, what caused the most like stress with him and that image

31:03.772 --> 31:11.458
[SPEAKER_00]: He, his primary identification was not as like a songwriter or as a singer or a vocalist but it was as a sex symbol, right?

31:11.558 --> 31:18.624
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, he was basically like, living a lie and that, again, that kind of pulls it you.

31:18.664 --> 31:20.686
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I think they were,

31:22.210 --> 31:23.331
[SPEAKER_00]: indications from jump.

31:23.391 --> 31:28.314
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, all of George Michael's kind of imagery is pulled from gay culture.

31:28.414 --> 31:28.634
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

31:29.315 --> 31:34.358
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, but it was also a much more innocent time and people didn't know what they didn't know.

31:35.219 --> 31:36.260
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what he was also.

31:37.783 --> 31:49.408
[SPEAKER_01]: somewhat, um, I don't know, famous or iconic or a trend center or whatever, but the constant facial hair changes and the changing of hair styles as well.

31:49.428 --> 31:56.091
[SPEAKER_01]: Like the George Michael, who's in his 30s, looked nothing like the guy from WAM, like almost completely different.

31:56.451 --> 31:57.131
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

31:57.231 --> 31:57.411
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

31:57.451 --> 31:57.731
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

31:57.931 --> 32:01.333
[SPEAKER_01]: The ability to switch your image and change your look and, you know,

32:02.773 --> 32:18.976
[SPEAKER_01]: whatever the reason that he did that for, but to grow up or to change, whatever it was, I always found that to be super interesting, because he's got the, you know, that 2000's facial hair, he's got like that Caesar cut that George Clooney was rocking.

32:19.276 --> 32:25.457
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's just very, very, he's very image conscience and always, you know, changing and adapting it.

32:25.717 --> 32:26.377
[SPEAKER_00]: Very much so.

32:26.677 --> 32:26.898
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

32:28.458 --> 32:28.798
[SPEAKER_01]: So,

32:30.151 --> 32:33.432
[SPEAKER_01]: Then, uh, I guess, well, let's just deep dive into faith.

32:33.492 --> 32:44.254
[SPEAKER_01]: So faith was recorded between August of 86 in September, 87 with the bulk of the work at, uh, puck studios.

32:44.534 --> 32:45.314
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm assuming this

32:55.353 --> 33:19.107
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... so why deadmark privacy he was away from the UK tabloids essentially um... the only song that he did not write or produce was a look at your hands with just co-written with david austin he also played many of the instruments himself uh... he used a Mitsubishi thirty-two track digital recorder and an SSL e-series console

33:19.987 --> 33:28.669
[SPEAKER_01]: The signature keyboard textures came from the Roland Juno 106 and the Yamaha DX 7.

33:29.709 --> 33:31.870
[SPEAKER_01]: This is like super nerdy.

33:31.890 --> 33:34.590
[SPEAKER_01]: Super tech nerdy stuff.

33:35.931 --> 33:47.354
[SPEAKER_01]: And there is lexicon and AMS reverbs and delays used throughout, though, George insisted the lead vocal on faith itself stayed dry.

33:47.434 --> 33:49.094
[SPEAKER_01]: No effects upfront.

33:50.460 --> 34:01.590
[SPEAKER_01]: So released on October 30, faith went to number one on both the UK and the Billboard 200 and spent 12 weeks at number one in the US.

34:01.650 --> 34:02.671
[SPEAKER_01]: That's insane.

34:03.832 --> 34:12.420
[SPEAKER_01]: Seven of the 10 tracks were released at as singles and almost an herd of rate for singles to album ratio.

34:13.781 --> 34:14.802
[SPEAKER_01]: I want your sex.

34:15.813 --> 34:16.153
[SPEAKER_01]: faith.

34:17.114 --> 34:33.650
[SPEAKER_01]: I want your sex actually only got to US number two, say only, faith got to US number one, father figure US number one, one more try US number one, monkey US number one, kissing a full US number five and then hard day was the other single.

34:34.811 --> 34:38.335
[SPEAKER_01]: And the album made Michael the second artist ever

34:39.637 --> 34:46.421
[SPEAKER_01]: after Michael Jackson's bad to score for number one, hot 100s from one album.

34:48.362 --> 34:53.726
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so some studio stories here that I found through the research.

34:54.866 --> 34:58.389
[SPEAKER_01]: Keyboardist Chris Cameron recalled hearing freedom

34:59.900 --> 35:06.506
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, actually, that's that's the wrong freedom is either the wham song or the, uh, the first one.

35:06.546 --> 35:07.687
[SPEAKER_00]: Two, two freedoms.

35:07.928 --> 35:09.449
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's not even on this album.

35:09.890 --> 35:25.023
[SPEAKER_01]: Bad research, um, uh, I guess the, this research is technically, uh, mostly, uh, based off of his history, not only this album, but, uh, monkey went through a full makeover.

35:25.824 --> 35:35.549
[SPEAKER_01]: courtesy of Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, fresh off of producing Janet Jackson, gave the track its new Jack swing remix treatment that helped push it to number one.

35:36.830 --> 35:48.957
[SPEAKER_01]: Michael's later said he was massively unhappy and lonely while writing faith and believed that emotional isolation is part of what let the songs connect so widely despite how commercial they were.

35:50.742 --> 35:59.484
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I'm gonna use a current pop culture moment that is happening right now because I just saw the new Spider-Man movie.

36:00.204 --> 36:00.584
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

36:01.404 --> 36:13.767
[SPEAKER_01]: And the major theme of this Spider-Man movie is even no matter how gifted you are, social interaction is very important.

36:15.265 --> 36:25.276
[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes when you are as gifted as some folks are, it is easy to be isolated for, you know, maybe you don't, you don't.

36:27.438 --> 36:35.685
[SPEAKER_01]: really vibe with folks who aren't as gifted as you or maybe folks don't want to vibe with you because of how gifted you are.

36:36.426 --> 36:43.532
[SPEAKER_01]: And I like I was watching this movie and I was like, you know, this is a pretty strong theme for a superhero movie.

36:45.673 --> 36:49.096
[SPEAKER_01]: And they, you know, they do it through the superhero way with the Spider-Man character.

36:49.176 --> 36:52.659
[SPEAKER_01]: I, I won't spoil it for people who don't who haven't watched yet.

36:53.580 --> 36:54.661
[SPEAKER_01]: But as I was watching, I was

36:58.038 --> 37:11.285
[SPEAKER_01]: music, that is athletics, that is intelligence, like if you think about it from that perspective, it is often hard,

37:12.640 --> 37:21.446
[SPEAKER_01]: to find your people, especially if you have like a one certain thing that is dialed up that other people don't have.

37:22.146 --> 37:29.751
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought about this when I was like watching the George Michael stuff and it's just so happens that I saw Spider-Man today.

37:30.652 --> 37:39.115
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, wow, like, that had to be tough because he had many things going on in his life that isolated him essentially.

37:39.315 --> 37:47.938
[SPEAKER_01]: And the major theme was he had, he was a hugely famous person, and he did not feel like he could be.

37:49.205 --> 38:03.907
[SPEAKER_01]: gay in public like it just wasn't going to work for for business reasons for celebrity reasons for whatever and that made him very isolated in addition to other things as well.

38:03.927 --> 38:16.029
[SPEAKER_01]: But man, you know, the this genius that we talk about like all of these people who we look at we go man, if I was just as talented as that person, it can also be so isolationally lonely.

38:20.419 --> 38:29.903
[SPEAKER_00]: If you are a, you know, people want to be in close proximity to fame and money, right?

38:30.303 --> 38:37.726
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you are rich in famous, the question for you was always going to be like, do these people want to be around me because I'm me?

38:38.646 --> 38:42.071
[SPEAKER_00]: or do these people want to be around me because of what they think I have?

38:42.552 --> 38:45.537
[SPEAKER_00]: Or what they know I have because, you know, if you're famous, they know you're famous.

38:46.778 --> 38:48.341
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't necessarily know how much money you have.

38:48.882 --> 38:51.966
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's always going to be like a couple of levels of distrust.

38:53.057 --> 38:56.019
[SPEAKER_00]: because it's like, okay, is this person a groupie?

38:56.139 --> 38:59.340
[SPEAKER_00]: Is this person a hangar on?

39:00.021 --> 39:12.587
[SPEAKER_00]: Is this person trying to like get something out of me that, you know, that my fame and my notoriety and my access to money or access to other people who are famous and rich might offer them?

39:13.128 --> 39:15.949
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that in itself just kind of like breeds distrust.

39:16.470 --> 39:20.612
[SPEAKER_00]: And then again, like here is this famous rich person

39:23.873 --> 39:27.874
[SPEAKER_00]: from everybody except the people who are like closest to him.

39:27.894 --> 39:31.435
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, okay, he can't walk into a gay bar.

39:31.895 --> 39:35.136
[SPEAKER_00]: He can't hold hands with the person that he's dating.

39:35.476 --> 39:42.998
[SPEAKER_00]: And then has to like suffer through, has to fall in love and suffer through the loss of the person that he falls in love with.

39:43.258 --> 39:44.438
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, like,

39:46.405 --> 40:05.091
[SPEAKER_00]: I, you know, doesn't tell the people, you know, doesn't tell people other than the people that is closest to, like it's not something that you can just like say the same way that I would be able to talk to my friends about, you know, if I was dating somebody and, you know, they passed away, like this happened.

40:05.651 --> 40:11.413
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think all of that just like breeds this loneliness and isolation, like in,

40:11.993 --> 40:26.604
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I think it's kind of a sign of the times, although, you know, there are certainly closeted famous people, tons of closeted famous people now, but, you know, there's a sense that you can't be yourself and that's got to like take something out of you personally.

40:27.411 --> 40:43.915
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and he had some pretty traumatic things happened to him in, you know, successive, with his partner passing, and then his mom passing not that long after, and then the record, the record, contract stuff, all happening like, so there's a lot of stuff going on.

40:44.295 --> 40:48.336
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, you know, in a short amount of time.

40:48.676 --> 40:48.876
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

40:50.216 --> 40:53.197
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so the faith album, the opener is faith,

40:55.211 --> 41:03.936
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, US number one, like we said, UK number two, uh, the leather jacket, the aviator glasses, the stubble.

41:04.216 --> 41:08.399
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, really defining the image of this album and who he was.

41:08.419 --> 41:14.342
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think, you know, if you think about how people would remember him, this is probably the look.

41:14.362 --> 41:15.283
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's the look.

41:15.483 --> 41:15.703
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

41:15.743 --> 41:16.804
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I was.

41:18.458 --> 41:21.279
[SPEAKER_00]: I was in seventh grade when faith came out.

41:21.480 --> 41:27.382
[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember that there was this kid in my seventh grade class named Nigel.

41:27.402 --> 41:38.208
[SPEAKER_00]: And he was of Indian like Asian Indian extraction and had facial hair and body hair.

41:38.288 --> 41:41.329
[SPEAKER_00]: Even at the age of like 12, 13 years old, however, all we were at that time.

41:42.130 --> 41:43.791
[SPEAKER_00]: And did the whole blonde street,

41:44.766 --> 41:47.969
[SPEAKER_00]: in the hair, the blonde highlight, and wore like to love Jack.

41:48.009 --> 41:53.894
[SPEAKER_00]: He worship George Michael and could pull off and, you know, George Michael is Greek.

41:53.914 --> 41:55.216
[SPEAKER_00]: He has fairly dark features.

41:55.376 --> 41:55.576
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

41:55.956 --> 42:01.882
[SPEAKER_00]: And could pull off like, here's this 13-year-old kid, who kind of looks like George Michael.

42:02.422 --> 42:03.383
[SPEAKER_00]: It was kind of strange.

42:04.484 --> 42:10.129
[SPEAKER_00]: But as we were talking about that, my brain immediately went back to that dude.

42:10.189 --> 42:10.950
[SPEAKER_01]: Father figure.

42:12.231 --> 42:22.180
[SPEAKER_01]: slower tune, a ballad about protective love, US number one, UK number 11.

42:22.841 --> 42:28.146
[SPEAKER_01]: As I was listening to this song, I was like, this might be one that I don't think MJ could have done.

42:28.166 --> 42:34.512
[SPEAKER_00]: Nah, I mean, MJ can't sing anything, couldn't sing anything that was like super sexy.

42:34.712 --> 42:34.972
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

42:36.147 --> 42:36.387
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

42:36.848 --> 42:37.068
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

42:37.908 --> 42:39.870
[SPEAKER_01]: And he wouldn't have been able to do this one as well.

42:40.130 --> 42:42.791
[SPEAKER_01]: I want your sex is next.

42:42.912 --> 42:43.752
[SPEAKER_01]: Funk driven.

42:44.833 --> 42:49.176
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess BBC restricted the airplane and some US markets banned it as well.

42:49.536 --> 42:49.756
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

42:49.916 --> 42:54.759
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, the reason that record was not a number one record is because of a radio station is that would not play it.

42:55.360 --> 42:55.620
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

42:56.301 --> 42:57.581
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think also empty.

42:57.681 --> 43:01.204
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he had to shoot a disclaimer for it to be be going MTV.

43:02.757 --> 43:11.723
[SPEAKER_01]: One more try stripped down ballad just his voice and an organ for for a most of it US number one.

43:12.164 --> 43:30.677
[SPEAKER_01]: What is your memories of one more try I mean we can talk about that when we do a top five yeah hard day more of a dance funk track US UK single hand to mouth as a social socially conscious track about poverty and inequality.

43:32.451 --> 43:57.386
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, look at your hands, the coat coat written by David Austin, the albums only non solo writing credit and we talked about monkey kissing a fool is the actual closer I the last track is I want your sex part three with the instrumental piece and torch like a jazzy kind of song and it went number one US adult contemporary.

43:59.149 --> 44:01.089
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he covered all the bases.

44:01.129 --> 44:06.390
[SPEAKER_00]: The album is really diverse, you know, he's taking influence from all these different things.

44:06.550 --> 44:17.492
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I want your sex in hard day kind of sound like Prince Little bit, you know, kissing a fool has like a, you know, very like jazzy kind of like shot day by father figure, actually kind of has like a shot day by two.

44:19.033 --> 44:24.134
[SPEAKER_01]: He should have got a, he should have got LL to lay some bars on father figure, you know, several years in advance.

44:24.154 --> 44:25.574
[SPEAKER_00]: Before it actually happened.

44:26.074 --> 44:28.695
[SPEAKER_01]: before LL just took that song for his name.

44:28.715 --> 44:34.198
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there weren't guest rappers on singing records at that time.

44:34.258 --> 44:34.439
[SPEAKER_00]: No.

44:34.799 --> 44:38.301
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, and George could do his own rap, and so he didn't need a local judge.

44:38.321 --> 44:44.864
[SPEAKER_01]: Do we know what the first ever rap feature on a song was?

44:45.364 --> 44:46.925
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it would have been like, I feel for you.

44:47.346 --> 44:47.666
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe.

44:49.106 --> 44:50.127
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that makes sense.

44:50.267 --> 44:51.568
[SPEAKER_01]: I was thinking of, um,

44:53.540 --> 44:57.022
[SPEAKER_01]: Gosh, what is the record that Eric would be a ruck him is on?

44:57.322 --> 44:57.642
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that it?

44:57.802 --> 44:59.423
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, friends of I Joey Watson?

44:59.443 --> 44:59.783
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

44:59.983 --> 45:01.103
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the one that I think.

45:01.123 --> 45:02.064
[SPEAKER_01]: That was your right.

45:02.084 --> 45:18.171
[SPEAKER_00]: That was the first, yes, that was the first top 10 pop record where a rapper was credited, but I mean, even like the first record I can think of with like R and B singing and rapping on it is candy girl, which I mean, they're all doing it themselves.

45:18.191 --> 45:19.252
[SPEAKER_01]: They're doing it themselves, yeah.

45:21.465 --> 45:26.087
[SPEAKER_01]: But if I think back to, I feel for you, I have no idea who does the rap in that song.

45:26.267 --> 45:27.027
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, smelly, no.

45:27.647 --> 45:28.207
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, is it?

45:28.387 --> 45:28.567
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

45:30.168 --> 45:35.610
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because I just remember watching the video and going like, I don't think Turbo knows on rap, so.

45:35.630 --> 45:37.590
[SPEAKER_00]: Turbo knows on and not rapping.

45:37.650 --> 45:39.211
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, so that's interesting.

45:39.231 --> 45:41.912
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because he doesn't get credited on the song.

45:42.112 --> 45:42.612
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, he doesn't.

45:43.673 --> 45:55.043
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so some more faith trivia, faith was the best selling single of 1988 in the U.S., it spent 51 weeks in the Billboard 200 top 10.

45:56.224 --> 46:02.190
[SPEAKER_01]: George Michael became the first white solo artist to top a Billboard's top black album, a chart.

46:03.463 --> 46:18.269
[SPEAKER_01]: Faith made him the second artist in history to land four number ones, like we said, and Michael played the guitar riff on faith himself despite not considering himself a real guitarist.

46:18.969 --> 46:22.811
[SPEAKER_01]: Where does this sit in kind of like your

46:24.412 --> 46:30.756
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, for one, I remember George Michael doesn't have blue eyes, but we always called like the white guy.

46:30.876 --> 46:32.617
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the blue eye soul white soul.

46:32.917 --> 46:38.240
[SPEAKER_01]: Where does he exist on your list of like the best white soul singers?

46:38.740 --> 46:39.921
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he's one of the best.

46:40.081 --> 46:45.864
[SPEAKER_00]: I, you know, George Michael Michael McDonald, Darrell Hall, Dusty Springfield,

46:49.630 --> 47:10.337
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'd even put Justin Timberlake in there, Robin thick, you know, George Michael is is I mean, he's one of the best of the best and I think he's like a true soul singer like he could, you know, he's one of those people that super diverse he could, you know, he can make a song like faith, which is.

47:11.473 --> 47:40.330
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, sort of like a, you know, more like bluesy kind of like roots see like rock ability kind of song and then make like a, you know, complete funk record, you know, but he's just again, a good, a great vocalist and was able to collaborate with, you know, he did records with jam in Louis and Louis, he did records with baby face, he collaborated with Mary Jay collaborated with Whitney, like he was very natural in, you know, in, in that world.

47:41.407 --> 47:47.534
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so how often do you listen to older and patient?

47:48.715 --> 47:50.237
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't listen to patients very often.

47:50.537 --> 47:51.838
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that's a very good album.

47:52.038 --> 47:54.481
[SPEAKER_00]: I think older is a great album, and I listen to that pretty regularly.

47:54.821 --> 48:00.588
[SPEAKER_01]: So how would you tear his albums with must listen, mid and four stands only?

48:01.429 --> 48:02.570
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think,

48:03.717 --> 48:12.204
[SPEAKER_00]: Faith, listen with that prejudice and older all must listen albums, um, yeah, I think if you've got those three, you don't really need anything else.

48:14.105 --> 48:16.207
[SPEAKER_01]: What is your no-skips rating for faith?

48:17.768 --> 48:29.877
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, it's interesting because, like, monkey needs the remix, or it's a really like pop.

48:33.040 --> 48:33.300
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

48:33.720 --> 48:33.940
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

48:34.181 --> 48:35.901
[SPEAKER_01]: I was thinking seven and a half eight for me.

48:36.262 --> 48:37.062
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

48:37.182 --> 48:38.483
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, you know, eight and a half nine.

48:38.503 --> 48:46.366
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I don't listen to that album straight through because, you know, there's more I want your sex than is needed.

48:47.907 --> 48:52.589
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, again, the version of monkey on the album is not like the pop version.

48:53.890 --> 48:55.150
[SPEAKER_00]: So you got to be a little creative.

48:55.791 --> 48:58.012
[SPEAKER_01]: So our Grammy Redux segment here.

48:59.493 --> 49:02.656
[SPEAKER_01]: He received eight Grammy names across his career one twice.

49:02.676 --> 49:12.307
[SPEAKER_01]: He won for album of the year in 89 for faith and best Aren't be vocal performance by do our group in 88 for a new year waiting with Arita.

49:14.258 --> 49:28.717
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you like the thing that he wanted to be at least as far as I could tell that he really wanted to be renowned for was as a great songwriter, but he was not even really nominated for anything.

49:30.005 --> 49:31.146
[SPEAKER_01]: song of the year, anything.

49:31.526 --> 49:33.127
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's so weird.

49:33.767 --> 49:37.589
[SPEAKER_01]: So the the the ones that I want to kind of go over again.

49:38.569 --> 49:43.691
[SPEAKER_01]: So in 1992, he was nominated for Best Male Performance for Freedom 90.

49:44.492 --> 49:46.092
[SPEAKER_01]: Here were the rest of the nominees.

49:46.233 --> 49:55.277
[SPEAKER_01]: Brian Adams, everything I do, I do for you, Mark Cohn, Walken and Memphis, Aaron Neville, Warm Your Heart, Michael Bolton, Winna Man, Loves of Women, and Seal, Crazy.

49:56.057 --> 50:00.440
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's George Michael easy and Michael Bolton wins with a man loves woman.

50:00.700 --> 50:00.960
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

50:01.281 --> 50:05.944
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, only other song on that list that I would even consider tolerable is that seal song.

50:07.165 --> 50:12.788
[SPEAKER_01]: So then I looked up the song of the year nominees for 1988, 1992.

50:12.808 --> 50:12.928
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh.

50:12.948 --> 50:13.049
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

50:13.069 --> 50:14.009
[SPEAKER_01]: They're all the same songs.

50:14.029 --> 50:14.189
[SPEAKER_01]: Really?

50:26.900 --> 50:28.241
[SPEAKER_01]: I think I may have messed this one up.

50:28.902 --> 50:30.783
[SPEAKER_01]: No, okay, sorry, I did screw it up.

50:30.944 --> 50:32.525
[SPEAKER_01]: They're not all the same songs.

50:32.785 --> 50:34.547
[SPEAKER_01]: There's only two that are the same.

50:35.268 --> 50:43.014
[SPEAKER_01]: So, baby, baby, Amy Grant and Keith Thomas, bright the bright Natum song and the Mark Cones song are also nominated.

50:43.255 --> 50:51.022
[SPEAKER_01]: Losing my religion, REM, unforgettable, Natalie Cole and freedom is not nominated.

50:52.151 --> 50:54.217
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, freedom wasn't like a huge hit.

50:54.437 --> 50:56.523
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it peaked at like number eight or something like that.

50:56.643 --> 50:58.067
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I mean,

51:00.342 --> 51:04.084
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are not great songs and losing my religion.

51:04.104 --> 51:04.785
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's only song.

51:04.805 --> 51:05.986
[SPEAKER_00]: I even like out of that group.

51:06.346 --> 51:10.068
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that's the one that has sort of lasted the test of time.

51:10.368 --> 51:12.950
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a bad list.

51:13.730 --> 51:16.672
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, when's the last time I heard unforgettable?

51:17.212 --> 51:19.393
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, it's had to be 20 years.

51:19.874 --> 51:20.074
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

51:20.474 --> 51:21.735
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, it's really weird.

51:21.795 --> 51:24.336
[SPEAKER_00]: And the Grammy award people don't do this anymore.

51:24.777 --> 51:28.399
[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, a song of the year is supposed to be a songwriter's award.

51:29.644 --> 51:31.045
[SPEAKER_00]: for songs that were written in that year.

51:31.386 --> 51:34.329
[SPEAKER_00]: And unforgettable was written in like the 30 or 40s or whatever.

51:35.010 --> 51:37.172
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, you know, make it make sense.

51:37.392 --> 51:38.153
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly.

51:38.674 --> 51:42.958
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, now here's where I wanted to go with and this dream collaborator thing.

51:43.338 --> 51:43.559
[SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

51:43.919 --> 51:47.743
[SPEAKER_01]: So he did collaborate with a good number of folks, some of which we've already mentioned.

51:47.783 --> 51:50.786
[SPEAKER_01]: So I read the Auretha song, Elton John,

51:51.527 --> 51:52.949
[SPEAKER_01]: don't let Sun go down on me.

51:52.969 --> 51:59.057
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, it was actually released as a live single in 1991 and did do.

51:59.398 --> 52:00.239
[SPEAKER_00]: Number one.

52:00.299 --> 52:00.559
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

52:01.501 --> 52:04.485
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, he did the win when Freddie Mercury died.

52:04.585 --> 52:08.770
[SPEAKER_01]: He did somebody to love, which is very famous performance.

52:09.471 --> 52:28.088
[SPEAKER_01]: There's an album on Whitney's greatest hits called, if I told you that, where he's with her, he and Mary J. Blige did Stevie Wonder's as, and the song is pulled off of the U.S. version of Mary's album because of his run-in with the cop, which is

52:31.996 --> 52:52.467
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so shitty because it is shitty, you know, I remember I was working in a record store when that song because that song got airplane on R&B radio in the U.S. And people would come in looking for it and be like, you can't buy it because it's not on anybody's record, in the UK, it is on

52:53.528 --> 53:06.280
[SPEAKER_00]: George Michael's greatest hits, my understanding is that marriage record company would not allow it to be released in the US for, you know, homophobia reasons would have made that out better.

53:06.955 --> 53:09.777
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, it's so, it, yeah.

53:10.258 --> 53:36.358
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and obviously since then, Mary's going on to collaborate with Elm John and Sam Smith, and you know, other artists who are part of the LGBTQIA plus community, but back in those days, you know, they didn't think that they mean the record industry thought it was like that press for Mary J to be on a record with a gay guy.

53:38.651 --> 53:41.252
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and then Tony Bennett and Paul McCartney, he also did songs with.

53:41.692 --> 53:42.092
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

53:42.112 --> 53:58.195
[SPEAKER_01]: So is there an artist that or or again, you know some some production production team or producer that you would have loved to have seen George work with and the well I'll I'll I'll I'll start it.

53:58.235 --> 54:02.376
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think this is the easy one like he even says that.

54:03.216 --> 54:11.481
[SPEAKER_01]: The reason why he covers a lot of Stevie Wonder songs is because Stevie Wonder Stevie Wonder writes the songs in the same key that he sings in.

54:11.501 --> 54:13.702
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're very easy for him to do.

54:14.402 --> 54:16.704
[SPEAKER_01]: And I would have loved to see him in Stevie work together.

54:17.264 --> 54:21.466
[SPEAKER_00]: I think there is footage of like him in Stevie in concert together.

54:21.526 --> 54:23.067
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not 100.

54:23.167 --> 54:24.368
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a Stevie concert.

54:26.449 --> 54:30.130
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, yeah, I mean, a Stevie Wonder George Michael collaboration would have been great.

54:30.850 --> 54:39.812
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, I just re-read Lionel Richie's book and, uh, you know, Lionel talks about how he would have loved to have collaborated with George Michael.

54:40.432 --> 54:41.833
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, and I think that would have been great.

54:42.313 --> 54:53.735
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, there is an album, you know, I alluded to this earlier in a conversation called Trojan Souls, which he was, he conceived as like a duet album, and he was going to work with all of these

54:57.817 --> 55:09.301
[SPEAKER_00]: people on the that would have been on the album included Arita who he had worked with before, but also Stevie Wonder, Shaday, Seal, and Janet Jackson would have been on that album.

55:09.341 --> 55:22.507
[SPEAKER_00]: I would have loved to have heard Janet Jackson George Michael collaboration, you know, even like, you know, Sam Smith and George Michael, or, you know, I think there's, there are a lot of artists that are, you know, come out in the last

55:27.328 --> 55:30.209
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, him and Adele, him and Amy Winehouse, would have been great.

55:32.729 --> 55:36.230
[SPEAKER_00]: So him and Justin Timberlake, I think would have been a great record.

55:36.250 --> 55:38.891
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, lots of people that he could have collaborated with.

55:39.691 --> 55:45.973
[SPEAKER_01]: Supposedly, he was also a pretty big fan of El Buggy, Lauren Hill.

55:46.473 --> 55:47.433
[SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't surprise me.

55:47.993 --> 55:54.215
[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, did you see their teasing another Fuji's album or another Fuji's thing again?

55:54.235 --> 55:55.755
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I read an article about that.

55:57.217 --> 55:59.838
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, no one wants to hear if Fuji's album in 2026.

56:00.118 --> 56:00.298
[SPEAKER_00]: No.

56:01.398 --> 56:04.740
[SPEAKER_01]: Then I think they want to hear more Lauren Hill.

56:04.860 --> 56:05.200
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

56:05.860 --> 56:09.321
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and I would crack a joke about pros with the reality that the situation is it.

56:09.381 --> 56:10.682
[SPEAKER_00]: No one wanted to hear pros then.

56:10.702 --> 56:13.843
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, his absence would not be felt.

56:15.590 --> 56:25.316
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so yeah, that's kind of a fun thought there just like to figure out like who could he have worked with.

56:25.336 --> 56:26.576
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm glad that we went there.

56:27.717 --> 56:31.439
[SPEAKER_01]: Is there anything else you want to talk about as it pertains to this album?

56:32.038 --> 56:56.993
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think it's a great album, I think I don't think that George Michael gets his just do as a singer and a songwriter and you know realistically speaking the amount of music he created is relatively small, comparatively speaking, but you know just such to me an important important artist in like my journey as a music lover and also I think my personal journey because

57:01.419 --> 57:10.045
[SPEAKER_00]: directly and openly about his sexuality until he was older, it was all in those lyrics.

57:10.186 --> 57:19.332
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can, there are certainly stuff that I was able to kind of pull out and extrapolate, as part of my own experience.

57:19.532 --> 57:20.994
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's a book series called 33 and 33.

57:21.114 --> 57:22.595
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a bunch of great books in it.

57:23.415 --> 57:25.197
[SPEAKER_00]: And there is a book about faith.

57:25.797 --> 57:27.779
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's worth picking up as well.

57:28.781 --> 57:39.500
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so we'll be back with our top five and I'm so interested in Mike's top five because you are probably the biggest George Michael fan.

57:39.600 --> 57:40.922
[SPEAKER_01]: I know for one and

57:43.803 --> 57:48.591
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to guess there are going to be some songs that were not even really on my radar.

57:48.651 --> 57:50.615
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm interested in seeing what you choose.

57:51.016 --> 57:53.800
[SPEAKER_00]: He's really funny because my top five list is like, all hits.

57:54.061 --> 57:54.562
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

57:54.642 --> 57:55.804
[SPEAKER_00]: Then maybe not.

57:56.365 --> 57:56.645
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

57:57.026 --> 57:59.691
[SPEAKER_01]: So we'll be back with the top five.

57:59.751 --> 58:02.535
[SPEAKER_01]: Check out 50 for 50 dot net.

58:02.996 --> 58:03.237
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

58:03.297 --> 58:04.299
[SPEAKER_01]: For Mike, I'm WG.

58:04.319 --> 58:05.861
[SPEAKER_01]: See you when we see you piece out.