Frank Ocean's Channel Orange: The Album That Influenced R&B Forever | 50 For 50

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[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back to 50 for 50.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This episode, probably gonna be on the shorter end, not because this artist is not as significant as others, actually very significant.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But it's because my man doesn't put out a lot of new music.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Freak ocean.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he does not put out a lot of music, has not put out a lot of not put out any music in a while.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, this is a constant for me, like when it comes to, like what would excite me?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like who can put it at an album?

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[SPEAKER_01]: That is not like an artist of like my childhood.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, if

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[SPEAKER_01]: you know, if Mariah decided to put out another new album, it'd be like, okay, that's cool.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'll listen to it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But an artist who comes out, you know, as I'm not a young, I'm not a young kid anymore when when Frank Ocean debuted.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And yet, I feel like there's so much there, like I'm just so interested into what he would be into in today's day and age, or like, what are the ideas that he has for music?

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[SPEAKER_01]: What would that new Frank Ocean album sound like?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So when blood orange, or channel orange, blood orange, channel orange hits, how much did you know about him if you remember?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't really remember.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think I knew that he was affiliated with odd future.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think at that point,

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[SPEAKER_00]: you know, maybe Tyler had had something out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Um, he was the most, um, like the most prominent member of our future.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I sort of knew who Frank Ocean was, but I sort of didn't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I knew very little.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then there's always been this discussion about the two albums.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even, do you even remember that visual album?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, how many times did you even hear that one?

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[SPEAKER_01]: because it just it was just on I just remember it being on iTunes and it was just like wasn't it just like one track like it what didn't even have tracks on it, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think it had tracks.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's hard for me to remember now, but essentially like he put that album out to get out of his contract right and I think it was a full album, but it wasn't like a fully formed like they weren't really songs.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They were kind of like little vignettes.

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[SPEAKER_01]: right, right, interesting.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then the discussion, and we can actually probably talk about this now, we chose channel oranges the focus because it just fit into the timeline from a 2012 perspective.

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[SPEAKER_00]: channel orange or a blonde for you if you had to pick a channel orange actually don't like blonde very much really yeah I remember being really disappointed in that album when it came out because I was like you know channel orange has songs it has songs that have like conventional song structure you know two verses two verses two choruses a bridge and a fade out and I don't know that any song on blonde is actually like a song in the conventional sense

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[SPEAKER_01]: I lean towards Channel Orange as well, though I asked two people who hold Frank very highly in their all-time grades.

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[SPEAKER_01]: My son Brian and my steps on Felix and I asked them both, I said, what album do you guys lean to?

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[SPEAKER_01]: And they both said blonde.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They both said,

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[SPEAKER_01]: channel orange and blonde are up there for them as far as albums, but blonde was the one that they lean towards the most and not like I'm with you, I actually like channel orange quite a bit better, but you know, I could tell there's a creative like,

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[SPEAKER_01]: ceiling to blonde that if you can, you know, kind of like think about Frank from this perspective of like the student's just creative as all hell.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I could definitely see why people like that out better.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, blonde is kind of like an art project.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, where his channel orange, I think is like an album in the traditional sense of what an album is.

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[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so let's go backwards

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[SPEAKER_01]: And you know what, what I realized when I was putting together some of these notes, uh, 2012 is kind of like the year of Katy Perry and Adele.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you could have, uh, I couldn't have even told you.

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[SPEAKER_01]: January 7, 2012, Katy Perry single the one that got away reaches number one on the hot dance club songs chart making teenage dream.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The first album in history to have seven songs from the same album reached number one on the hot dance club songs chart.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Also, only the third album in history to have six singles from the same album reached the top five in the Billboard 100.

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[SPEAKER_00]: it's Katy Perry still a thing I think so I think I think she got canceled for a minute, but I think TikTok has revived her.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She's still doing American idol.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Ah, I think so.

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[SPEAKER_00]: No, I'm not sure.

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[SPEAKER_00]: No, she's not, because I think she got replaced by Carrie Underwood.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Carrie Underwood.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, got it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What didn't, wasn't the story with Katy

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[SPEAKER_01]: fondle the dude like randomly or something.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it was a dude.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think it was another woman.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, was it a woman?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I thought, okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was a woman.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think it was a woman.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So she was just thinking that everyone was sexually aroused by her or something.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't, you know, she's, I mean, there's a few different ways that she's problematic.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think one is the whole Russell brand.

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[SPEAKER_00]: you know, being involved with him, you know, I think she's been accused of what the young people call queer baiting for a long time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, she basically got famous with the song about, you know, oh, I'm kissing girls.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Isn't this like cute and adorable?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think actual gay people who get, you know, criticized for stuff like that took a fence as they probably

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[SPEAKER_01]: wasn't she also much like Jessica Simpson like raised uh she was even jellicle yeah yeah she was she came out i think is like a Christian pop artist interesting so interesting the the rebelliousness um all right so on uh January 20th edit James passes away at the age of 73

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[SPEAKER_01]: At last, one of the most sung songs like in history, I feel like most of the weddings I have been to that song has had a place at it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wedding and funerals, I feel like.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's like crosses over like a bunch of different places I think, like, I don't know, it's like that song and of itself is just like,

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[SPEAKER_01]: that song will last longer than almost any other song, I think, in pop music or in music.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's definitely, you know, it's a standard.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I've never really listened to lyrics enough to determine whether it's like applicable to funerals.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like maybe, you know, I did it my ways.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Might be like a more, feels like a more funeral oriented song,

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, two or three dozen weddings over the course of my life and at last is a pretty constant.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, for sure.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it seems like it's it seems like it could fit if you wanted it to fit.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just looking up the lyrics.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, it's it's pretty.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's not very specific as to what the the song is about.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's just about love and and stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So interesting.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Adele, February 4th, 2012, set fire to the rain, which is number one on the Billboard Hot 100, making her album 21, the first album in history that three number one songs from the same album by a British female artist.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This is something that we talked about already on 50 for 50 February 11th music icon when Houston is found dead at the age of 48 in her Los Angeles hotel room hours before pre-grammy party hosted by Clive Davis.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, indeed.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, sad times.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We went through that one.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And so the very next day.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The Grammy Awards, which they had to kind of redo to make it somewhat about in the Houston.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Adele wins six awards for 21, including out with the year song of the year record of the year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Bonnie Verwin's best new artist, which was an interesting one.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because he was not a new artist, but I have a number correctly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And Kanye West and the food fighters sweep their respective categories.

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[SPEAKER_01]: March 3rd, Adele again becomes the first fee of all artists have three singles at the top 10 in the billboard 100 at the same time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Wow, and the first female artists have two albums in the top five of the billboard 200 and two singles in the top five of the billboard 100 simultaneously.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like that's probably happened a lot since because, you know, this is pre-spotify.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes, for sure.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then Katie Perry again, part of me, they've used that number one on the Hot 100, becoming only the 20th song in history to debut a top chart.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's her seventh consecutive top five.

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[SPEAKER_01]: uh... this feels like uh... people figuring out how to game these charts here because just in beavers boyfriend as the second highest first week sales of a new single debut at number two on the billboard hot one hundred later on surpassed by Taylor Swift's we are never ever getting back together the six hundred and twenty three thousand sales making a beaver the third highest first week sale that is on April the fourth

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[SPEAKER_01]: Another one that we covered, another sad one is May 4th, rapper Adam, MCA out of the beastie boys, dies of cancer at the age of 47, that number, how old he was, still just, it can say.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, he was, Whitney was 48, he was 47, you know, it's kind of insane.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Another passing may 17th, Donna Summer, yeah, at the time of 63.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now remember, MC and Donna Summer being like right next to one another.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So might the resource that I use your skips a few months.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So there's not much left here.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if it was stuff not newsworthy or they just did not have the website, it in of itself kind of got messed up.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But August 12th again, Katy Perry,

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[SPEAKER_01]: Wide awake peaks at number two becoming her ninth and final top 10 single from the teenage dream era.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And in October 22nd Taylor Swift releases red and it sells 1.2 million copies in the first week, debuting at number one on the Billboard 200, the second highest debut for a female artist.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then 14 years later, she would get married at Madison Square Garden.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Shh.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure that Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey are not bad people.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Actually, like Travis Kelsey, but man, whatever happens to like, have a small wedding ceremony with like your friends and family, wherever you come from.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You mean not all your business partners?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just, it's so like, I don't know.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like at this point, everything Taylor Swift does kind of, doesn't feel great to me.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So how much of this is the, we've talked about Michael before and you know, Michael would utilize the media in ways

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, that's essentially the later stages of his careers.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's creating interesting things that he's doing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, the, I think what makes this different is Taylor is doing it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This is, you know, it's not because of an album coming out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's just because these people are willing to pay

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[SPEAKER_01]: to like I imagine there's going to be some television show about this wedding, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like yeah, some reality show or some movie, like to make you're wedding into like a movie and put into if if that happens, that to me is like the most crass, like capitalist gross thing you could possibly like it just feels, I don't know.

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[SPEAKER_00]: All right, you know, it, it, it just feels gross.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And if you are Taylor and I hope that they stay married forever, but they're both ones of sports celebrity ones, the biggest pop celebrity, what the biggest artist in the game right now.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And so there's, there's lots of stuff that could happen in their lives, just be sure how famous they are.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But then if you're either of them and something does fall out and whatever happens happens, they

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's a rebirth, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's oh, it's the new version of me.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And here's how the angle takes.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's kind of like it's just going to keep happening.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think I don't think there's any stopping no matter what.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, if Taylor has a child, that's going to be a thing, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I don't think the terminology do it for the gram was around in 2012.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But it feels like everything Taylor Swift does.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She does for the gram.

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[SPEAKER_01]: what was do it for the gram or do it for the vine first there was a version was members there was a version of vine there for a little bit that like we could only it was like a 10 seconds or something video that you can do it just I mean to me it's so

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's just so crass, like, I just, you know, or something that doesn't, it didn't feel right when Michael did it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, to her, I imagine she sees herself as a product and she's like, it's all about splint demand.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I have, you know, this story, I have this product, I have this music, I have a lifestyle that people want to buy and thus I'm going to give it to them

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[SPEAKER_01]: But that is kind of today's commercialism from her because I'm so Mike and I are going to do an episode on Clive Davis who passed away as of our recording he passed away a little while ago and Clive Davis tells us story about Bob Dylan and he says that Bob Dylan was signed to Columbia.

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[SPEAKER_01]: MGM came in with an offer and Bob Dylan had either signed it or was in the process of signing it and then something happened at MGM where there was a possibility for him to undo it and to come back to Columbia.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And Clive Davis said Bob Dylan had just gotten in a motorcycle accident.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And instead of like Bob Dylan, like kind of stepped away and the mysteriousness of what happened to Bob Dylan kind of created the hype for the next thing that he was going to create, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: And not like Bob Dylan is like the,

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[SPEAKER_01]: you know, he wasn't selling, you know, the most records of anybody back then, but the way that he understood his art was to make the album and to let the music kind of sit there and and be what it was.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And it's just like compared to what, you know, Taylor's doing today.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time with where the music industry is and how you actually make your living and

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[SPEAKER_01]: She's she's creating this strategy that I imagine a lot of other people are going to try and copy, but they're just not famous.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like you have to have a level of fame to do and a level of fandom like Beyonce if she wanted to follow a similar template.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She doesn't have the widest audience that Taylor has, but she does have a really big audience.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and she's done some of those things like lemonade in the video and all that stuff where you're like okay the whole the whole made up jz cheated on me in the elevator and all that stuff you take yeah she's taking advantage of the a story or narrative and of her power as a female artist or celebrity who people look look up to

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[SPEAKER_01]: But still like not to this level that we see with Taylor and I kind of wonder, you know, you see some of these younger artists like in Olivia Rodrigo or something and they kind of look up to Taylor in this way.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I wonder if like they think about it like, oh, if I could get here, I could kind of follow in these footsteps.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of interesting to see what people can do, but I don't know, I just don't sense that the level of fame or celebrity is gonna get to close enough to what Taylor has right now.

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[SPEAKER_01]: For whatever reason, like Taylor is not,

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[SPEAKER_01]: She's not unique.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She's not that interesting.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She created this follow- It is the triumph of the mediocre white woman.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But there's so many mediocre white women.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Why her?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think she speaks to the fact that there are so many mediocre white women in this world.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of like if I can make it, if she can make it, then I can too.

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[SPEAKER_00]: just kind of like conceivably average people.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But I think what average people don't have is a father with financial backing that can get them in the door and the music industry as a teenager and have them sign a contract.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I also think where Taylor Swift benefits is that she was able to become popular during the era before

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[SPEAKER_00]: TikTok and social media and all that stuff, and kind of caught the cusp of that, and then kind of was smart enough to write it into this era.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think anyone that's going to come after her is going to attain a similar level of success.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I thought about this a little bit, so this may be but not a ton, so this may be a little half-baked, this idea.

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[SPEAKER_01]: As we know, Taylor Swift, Kanye West, Kim Kardashian, they were always kind of a part of this real or fake rivalry that I don't think currently exists.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure where they all stay and with each other.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't think anybody cares.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think they care.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think they're just out of their orates.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But, Kim Kardashian did it a different way.

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[SPEAKER_01]: She did not become famous in the same way that Taylor Swift became famous.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Kim Kardashian got things for taking back shots.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Poor Ragey, man.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He did not get that famous.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, we did not.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But I think there's kind of a parallel of how they both are able to take advantage of today's obsession with pop culture and celebrity.

20:27.376 --> 20:29.437
[SPEAKER_01]: Now Taylor has a music aspect of it.

20:29.497 --> 20:37.824
[SPEAKER_01]: Now there is there is something in in the art form in the talent of hers to be able to cultivate that from music.

20:38.044 --> 20:39.265
[SPEAKER_01]: Kim doesn't have that.

20:39.685 --> 20:45.090
[SPEAKER_01]: Though she has still been able to build businesses around reality television and celebrity.

20:45.390 --> 20:46.391
[SPEAKER_01]: But like.

20:47.011 --> 20:54.933
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think they both are able to take advantage of the current situation in similar ways, even if they got there in different ways.

20:55.533 --> 21:07.497
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's kind of like, on one hand, get your bag, you know, on the other hand, I mean, I just, I did the idea that there are people that admire Kim Kardashian makes me want to throw up.

21:08.384 --> 21:10.205
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, she's, she's attractive.

21:10.305 --> 21:12.366
[SPEAKER_01]: That's funny.

21:12.566 --> 21:19.769
[SPEAKER_01]: I think she's, I think she's attractive, but it's also, you know, there's there's lots of work that has been done.

21:20.129 --> 21:20.890
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

21:21.090 --> 21:23.031
[SPEAKER_00]: There are plenty of attractive people out there.

21:24.351 --> 21:25.012
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't you remember?

21:26.402 --> 21:29.804
[SPEAKER_01]: when Paris and Nicole had to show.

21:29.964 --> 21:39.009
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they used to make fun of Kim, I thought show, even though they were all friends, but it was like, Kim's family wasn't quite as rich as theirs.

21:39.189 --> 21:39.489
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

21:39.829 --> 21:47.713
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, at the end of the day, like at the very least, Taylor Swift is talented, you know, she's a talented songwriter, talented musician.

21:49.154 --> 21:49.454
[SPEAKER_00]: Like,

21:51.342 --> 21:57.066
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, makes catchy music like there's that, um, I don't know, man.

21:57.106 --> 22:04.750
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, it's, I feel like all of those people are kind of cut through the same cloth and, and their opposites on the booty spectrum though.

22:05.011 --> 22:06.832
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, for sure, for sure.

22:07.612 --> 22:10.454
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, and I, you know, there's also a piece of

22:19.018 --> 22:40.970
[SPEAKER_00]: the damsel and distress against the church against the yeah the poor white girl against the big angry black man uh and kind of wrote that narrative a little bit which again is gross but you know i mean not that Kanye is completely or at all innocent here either no it's just yeah it's it's like a cesspool of grossness yeah

22:50.926 --> 22:56.029
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, didn't it have something to do with New Orleans and Katrina or something like that?

22:57.270 --> 23:01.973
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's part Frank Sinatra.

23:02.573 --> 23:04.975
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, and part Oceans 11.

23:05.695 --> 23:07.836
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I was totally wrong.

23:08.096 --> 23:09.557
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know, I didn't know that either.

23:09.617 --> 23:12.859
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just watched Oceans 11 like a week ago.

23:13.279 --> 23:13.660
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

23:14.540 --> 23:17.542
[SPEAKER_01]: So he's born Christopher Edwin.

23:18.640 --> 23:22.401
[SPEAKER_01]: Bro, bro, B-R-E-A-U-X.

23:22.902 --> 23:29.704
[SPEAKER_00]: That might be, bro, you know, one of those like Creole New Orleans French things.

23:30.305 --> 23:32.765
[SPEAKER_00]: He was actually born in California.

23:33.206 --> 23:33.646
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.

23:33.666 --> 23:36.427
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they relocated the family relocated.

23:36.807 --> 23:39.468
[SPEAKER_01]: to New Orleans, to New Orleans when he was five.

23:39.768 --> 23:40.048
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

23:40.689 --> 23:47.011
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's kind of where he's exposed to the to the music and to the environment.

23:48.132 --> 23:56.955
[SPEAKER_01]: Pops, I guess pops was not around post his very young years.

23:57.676 --> 24:04.038
[SPEAKER_01]: But moms, I think a lot of her influences were became his influences.

24:04.118 --> 24:05.119
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, talk

24:06.055 --> 24:15.282
[SPEAKER_01]: knowing what you want to do, according to the research at 13 years old, he was like, I'm going to be a songwriter.

24:15.462 --> 24:17.164
[SPEAKER_01]: That's wild.

24:18.345 --> 24:24.609
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was not even, I don't even think I was writing good papers yet at 13 years old.

24:26.331 --> 24:27.832
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, so,

24:29.197 --> 24:51.770
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, he had, he had kind of, uh, you know, done some some stuff to kind of fund this this idea of being in music, you know, side jobs and stuff at a very young age and when he reinvented himself with the Frank Sinatra and oceans 11 tag he became Frank Ocean and then you were right about the Katrina thing because in 2005.

24:54.008 --> 25:01.090
[SPEAKER_01]: the storm destroys the recording facility that he's using at the time.

25:01.470 --> 25:07.732
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's when he realized he needed to move back to California to really pursue his career.

25:08.152 --> 25:08.452
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

25:11.568 --> 25:15.209
[SPEAKER_01]: he joined odd future in 2010.

25:15.890 --> 25:19.591
[SPEAKER_01]: So Tyler the creator and who is the rest of odd future?

25:19.611 --> 25:23.312
[SPEAKER_00]: Or I mean, Earl is Earl sweatshirt.

25:23.412 --> 25:24.793
[SPEAKER_00]: There's Sid.

25:27.762 --> 25:28.403
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a whole bunch.

25:28.443 --> 25:42.218
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, art features kind of like a rotating cast, but yeah, I mean, Tyler and Earl said Steve Lacey, the internet, all of those people are all sort of like in the art future universe.

25:43.839 --> 26:06.073
[SPEAKER_01]: So he does a song or he writes a song for Justin Bieber's debut EP My World, it's called Bigger and it makes the cut of the album and that was kind of the validation that he was moving in the right direction but he had written songs for other people as well which will get to that actually did make albums and such.

26:06.633 --> 26:10.016
[SPEAKER_01]: And so he puts out his mix tape and nostalgia

26:10.916 --> 26:11.396
[SPEAKER_01]: ultra.

26:11.657 --> 26:13.338
[SPEAKER_01]: Have you heard this before this album?

26:13.878 --> 26:14.098
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.

26:14.499 --> 26:14.959
[SPEAKER_00]: What was it?

26:15.199 --> 26:15.679
[SPEAKER_00]: How was it?

26:16.140 --> 26:19.202
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean nostalgia ultra actually might be better than channel orange.

26:19.322 --> 26:19.762
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh really.

26:19.982 --> 26:20.243
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

26:21.103 --> 26:24.345
[SPEAKER_01]: So it it was like um

26:25.551 --> 26:34.155
[SPEAKER_01]: a mixtape that made it on all like the the best of list because I remember thinking like how do you listen to this thing like where do you find it?

26:34.676 --> 26:41.619
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean it was on like that pitch and you know you back in the day you had all those kind of like music blogs that you could download music from.

26:41.919 --> 26:45.921
[SPEAKER_01]: Is it out there now because when I looked at for Frank stuff I only saw the two albums.

26:46.201 --> 26:49.603
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a couple of songs on streaming services but not the whole album.

26:49.943 --> 26:54.546
[SPEAKER_00]: I think there was some like there's definitely some sample clearance issues that he would

26:55.446 --> 26:59.229
[SPEAKER_00]: have to take care of if that album was to be made commercially available.

27:00.650 --> 27:05.434
[SPEAKER_01]: So before Channel Orange Drops, he posts on Tumblr.

27:06.315 --> 27:07.256
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you have a Tumblr?

27:07.956 --> 27:09.778
[SPEAKER_01]: I had, I mean, I've had multiple Tumblr's.

27:10.577 --> 27:21.881
[SPEAKER_01]: At the least that tumbler was a very cool service that I don't know why I didn't take off bigger than it did or why I didn't last maybe just blogging in of itself kind of was I think blogging went away.

27:21.901 --> 27:22.341
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

27:22.561 --> 27:24.762
[SPEAKER_00]: I always thought that was such a cool service.

27:25.462 --> 27:26.343
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the thing tumbler.

27:26.363 --> 27:34.245
[SPEAKER_00]: There is an issue with tumbler where they for a period of time decided that they were not going to

27:38.927 --> 27:41.169
[SPEAKER_01]: there was a lot of adult content up to.

27:41.229 --> 27:50.057
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and there was a lot of porn on Tumblr, and I think a lot of people, there was an exit as a result of that, and it just never got came back from that.

27:50.418 --> 27:54.041
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I do think that now adult material is allowed on Tumblr again.

27:55.322 --> 27:57.544
[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't thought about Tumblr in quite a while.

27:58.698 --> 28:03.260
[SPEAKER_01]: And I know there are some Tumblr accounts that I have that are out there that... Yeah, for sure.

28:03.680 --> 28:13.745
[SPEAKER_01]: I... You know, if we had any foresight to creating all of these accounts, I think we'd probably delete all of them.

28:13.965 --> 28:17.066
[SPEAKER_01]: But I have no idea where my name is on so many websites.

28:17.546 --> 28:18.327
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, seriously.

28:19.107 --> 28:20.188
[SPEAKER_00]: Until there's a date of reach.

28:20.568 --> 28:20.808
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

28:22.128 --> 28:22.809
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so...

28:23.914 --> 28:49.003
[SPEAKER_01]: before a channel orange drops he goes on tumblr he publishes a letter recounting his first love at 19 a young man who changed his perspective on sexuality and identity and do you remember like what was the how was that received back then?

28:50.794 --> 28:57.096
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that a lot of people were surprised.

28:58.496 --> 29:04.098
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that there was no precedent for that, right?

29:04.258 --> 29:09.599
[SPEAKER_00]: Like Frank Ocean was like this big deal about to release a huge record.

29:09.619 --> 29:14.721
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is, he was in terms of black men

29:17.886 --> 29:19.647
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, queerness.

29:20.267 --> 29:21.168
[SPEAKER_00]: He was the first.

29:21.548 --> 29:21.749
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

29:22.109 --> 29:22.970
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know,

29:24.390 --> 29:33.838
[SPEAKER_00]: there wasn't anybody in the R&B world or the hip-hop world who was a person of color, who was young and who was out.

29:34.079 --> 29:45.849
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody that was out to that point had either been outed posthumously, or were kind of past their prime, like weren't really commercially viable anymore.

29:46.249 --> 29:49.792
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, Frank Ocean was like at that time, one of one,

29:50.813 --> 29:56.016
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was like, you know, it was all over the news, all over Twitter, all over everything.

29:56.036 --> 29:57.276
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, it was a big deal.

29:59.977 --> 30:13.283
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, because and also because he was adjacent to the hip hop world and hip hop world that it was not kind historically and still isn't, you know, um, I don't listen to any new hip hop songs.

30:13.303 --> 30:13.584
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

30:13.704 --> 30:16.245
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it still isn't, but it's still very much like a

30:17.871 --> 30:22.936
[SPEAKER_00]: genre that is centered around toxic masculinity in a lot of ways.

30:24.097 --> 30:32.165
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think people were applauding the bravery of Frank Ocean and you know it was a big deal.

30:32.885 --> 30:40.633
[SPEAKER_01]: I've always thought about this and we've had this conversation on different topics but when you listen to songs from your youth

30:41.687 --> 30:46.511
[SPEAKER_01]: that have homophobic slurs or that have, and I'll just tease this.

30:47.071 --> 30:57.359
[SPEAKER_01]: We're gonna do an episode on Wu Ting on the first album, but also I wanna focus on kind of how everybody created a solo career out of that first album.

30:58.200 --> 31:07.587
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm listening to all of these albums and Bobby digital of all of the albums, like this album does not age well.

31:08.067 --> 31:09.649
[SPEAKER_01]: My man is mad at women.

31:12.182 --> 31:20.668
[SPEAKER_01]: someone did him wrong and he's taken it out on a singular woman on this album because there's multiple songs where it's just, you know, just really, really negative.

31:21.569 --> 31:23.831
[SPEAKER_01]: But when we grew up,

31:25.320 --> 31:34.622
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just kind of part of the music, whether there was homophobia, or whether there was just negativity towards women, different races.

31:35.402 --> 31:40.124
[SPEAKER_01]: And we just kind of took that as part of the story of the person who was telling it.

31:40.924 --> 31:47.245
[SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, now as, again, 50 for 50, I can't, can you listen to it in the same way?

31:47.305 --> 31:49.066
[SPEAKER_01]: Like how do you deal with that?

31:49.526 --> 31:50.366
[SPEAKER_01]: Nah, I...

31:52.012 --> 31:54.675
[SPEAKER_00]: for detox maybe two or three years ago.

31:54.855 --> 32:00.861
[SPEAKER_00]: I did an episode with my man Kevin Patterson who is, you know, we're about the same age.

32:01.622 --> 32:08.770
[SPEAKER_00]: He grew up in like Jersey, I grew up in Brooklyn, both, you know, major like hip hop heads and

32:11.125 --> 32:20.493
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, he is only now sort of coming into his queerness or identifying his queerness, whereas I've been in or out, you know, for most of my adult life.

32:21.294 --> 32:33.305
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, we talked about being hip-hop fans and being hip-hop fans who are, you know, either allies or a part of

32:37.128 --> 32:42.491
[SPEAKER_00]: He was like, I think about it the way a lot of women who love hip-hop think about it, where it's like, they're not talking about me.

32:43.612 --> 32:54.058
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's kind of cognitive dissonance that I understand, but also it's like, they are talking about you, right?

32:54.218 --> 32:57.540
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you can't, like, you're just playing mind tricks on yourself.

32:57.600 --> 33:00.002
[SPEAKER_00]: If you don't think that they're talking about you, like,

33:01.529 --> 33:02.850
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's hard, right?

33:02.950 --> 33:05.332
[SPEAKER_00]: Because I come from that environment.

33:06.233 --> 33:10.937
[SPEAKER_00]: And when I was 17, 18, 19 years old, the younger, I was calling people faggets.

33:10.977 --> 33:13.680
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I was doing, I was talking while shit too.

33:13.920 --> 33:14.240
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

33:15.461 --> 33:19.024
[SPEAKER_00]: But some of these people never grew out of that.

33:19.245 --> 33:19.505
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

33:20.709 --> 33:47.687
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think, you know, there's somebody like Common who has, you know, early in his career made some records that had like some questionable homophobic shit on it and then kind of turned around and has made records that are now supportive of the queer community and it's like if you show that narrative arc that makes the difficult stuff a little bit easier to listen to, but like there are songs.

33:49.290 --> 33:57.216
[SPEAKER_01]: that I grew up listening to that I would get pumped up at with DMX that I absolutely cannot listen to anymore and they still play them on the radio.

33:57.296 --> 34:00.158
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I mean, I never really fucked with DMX like that.

34:00.879 --> 34:03.201
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, but, you know, there's

34:04.565 --> 34:21.932
[SPEAKER_00]: Punks jump up to get beat down by brand new beans, which is like 100% homophobic and I've I've fucked with that song hard as a kid and I can't listen to it now, um, you know, Biggie says, if I got a couple of times already did the end life after death and I can't re listen to that shit now.

34:22.552 --> 34:29.935
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's it's like I understand the space that it came from because I came from that space too.

34:31.117 --> 34:42.781
[SPEAKER_00]: But I can't as a 50-year-old in good conscience listening to even going back to Wu Tang, there's a song on a Ghost Face album called Nutmeg with him and Rizza.

34:43.441 --> 34:50.043
[SPEAKER_00]: And it is just there is some Rizza's verse in particular, some wild misogynists like kind of gross shit.

34:50.843 --> 34:55.064
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, the Bobby, the Bobby digital.

34:55.244 --> 34:55.564
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

34:56.204 --> 35:01.365
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, or the skit before method man, where he's talking about, I'm like, like, take the asshole shit.

35:01.385 --> 35:01.705
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.

35:01.745 --> 35:02.065
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

35:02.085 --> 35:02.385
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

35:02.625 --> 35:04.385
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't listen to any of that stuff anymore.

35:04.426 --> 35:05.626
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just like, it's gross.

35:05.906 --> 35:06.106
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

35:06.626 --> 35:07.566
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

35:07.906 --> 35:08.186
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

35:08.226 --> 35:10.567
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and we're, we're off a little bit of attention.

35:10.587 --> 35:10.727
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

35:10.747 --> 35:11.587
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I can't do it.

35:11.647 --> 35:18.048
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think because of who Frank is, I think this is actually a good conversation because when you and I first met,

35:19.484 --> 35:48.362
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, how long was it because you told me you were like, that like, you know, this is who I am and I was like, oh, like, because I, I didn't, you know, we were in this community and how you identified, I don't remember if I thought, oh, yeah, you know, but you had even told me when you were younger that you, you know, you dated women and stuff to just kind of figure things out, but do you think that or have you even thought about?

35:49.199 --> 36:15.130
[SPEAKER_01]: how many people you have either comforted or influenced or helped get through this process that you yourself had to do and I'm sure you may have had a mentor or two yourself but like have you have you have you been are you cognizant of of that of like how you have helped people or been a shoulder to cry and or an ear for people.

36:19.826 --> 36:42.172
[SPEAKER_00]: I, there have been people who have articulated to me that I have been a model for them to either confront their own homophobia or, you know, sort of walk out of the closet themselves and, you know, that's a great feeling.

36:45.207 --> 36:49.981
[SPEAKER_00]: I think everybody kind of has a responsibility to model behavior for people.

36:53.169 --> 37:05.438
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, yeah, I mean, I guess I answer your question, yes, it has been stated to me explicitly that there, I mean, and I don't know what the magnitude of that is.

37:05.498 --> 37:15.866
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure there are people that helped or influenced that have not reflected that back to me, but you know, I'm fortunate that on some occasions it has been reflected back to me.

37:16.086 --> 37:17.967
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess I'm trying to say and not that you're

37:18.857 --> 37:23.701
[SPEAKER_01]: doing it for backpats or for, like, thank you, is there anything?

37:23.761 --> 37:38.472
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think, like, you know, you should feel that acknowledgment and you should feel that, that is, I think that is something to be very proud of to be that person for others.

37:38.892 --> 37:40.213
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't do it for backpats.

37:40.614 --> 37:43.156
[SPEAKER_00]: I do it A because I think it's really important

37:44.173 --> 37:53.819
[SPEAKER_00]: to live your life authentically, but also I do it because, you know, there wasn't really anybody that did that for me.

37:53.999 --> 38:09.890
[SPEAKER_00]: I was, I was a whole adult before I met another openly gay or bisexual man and definitely a full ass adult before I met another openly gay or bisexual black person.

38:10.530 --> 38:11.751
[SPEAKER_00]: black man, I should say.

38:12.252 --> 38:15.814
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a black Roman high school that was out as lesbian.

38:16.475 --> 38:30.546
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, you know, had there been somebody like that in my life when I was younger, maybe the process of coming out as a young adult might have been

38:31.587 --> 38:35.989
[SPEAKER_00]: a little easier or I had somebody to confide in that I felt more comfortable around or whatever it was.

38:36.369 --> 38:49.815
[SPEAKER_00]: And now people have social media and they're all these supportive avenues that don't necessarily require somebody to be right in front of you to model the behavior, but I at our age like we didn't have that back then.

38:50.095 --> 38:51.336
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for sure.

38:54.377 --> 38:55.358
[SPEAKER_01]: In my kind of

38:56.542 --> 39:02.324
[SPEAKER_01]: inner community with the other podcasts that I do BSPN and, you know, I cover Bay Area sports.

39:03.684 --> 39:12.906
[SPEAKER_01]: The team that my favorite baseball team that I grew up with that, you know, we cover, they had a situation where they hosted Pride night.

39:14.267 --> 39:15.367
[SPEAKER_01]: And they read about this.

39:15.627 --> 39:18.848
[SPEAKER_01]: They had four players, three of them.

39:19.772 --> 39:41.706
[SPEAKER_01]: wrote a Bible verse that I think has been kind of used and abused by folks who want to show how against homophobia they are and they use Jesus' words right in this and then there was another guy who just would refuse to wear the pride hat which is I think I think Major League Baseball gives the

39:42.226 --> 39:45.187
[SPEAKER_01]: folks, the freedom to not wear the pride hat if they don't want to.

39:45.207 --> 39:45.847
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

39:46.127 --> 39:54.629
[SPEAKER_01]: So these four people in San Francisco of all places decided to do this demonstration.

39:55.769 --> 40:04.992
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, it was really the talk of the town and how do you separate your fandom from something like this, but me and

40:10.300 --> 40:14.423
[SPEAKER_01]: public with our feelings of like, this stuff just doesn't cut it, man.

40:14.503 --> 40:26.452
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you know, if you believe that you're doing this to show your religious community, how.

40:27.807 --> 40:55.656
[SPEAKER_01]: how religious you still are like there's this other piece of it and to me, I'm going to say the majority of people who you're basically saying, I'm against this and so that's being a bigot and to your religious community, you're thinking that you're showing some loyalty and some trust and so we really put it on the management as far as like, you know, where's the leadership,

40:57.132 --> 41:09.233
[SPEAKER_01]: Where are the vocal leaders to basically tell the community that these guys, you know, kind of rally to against like we're abeliously say, hey.

41:11.038 --> 41:13.420
[SPEAKER_01]: They did this, but this is not what we stand for.

41:14.321 --> 41:15.822
[SPEAKER_01]: And it was really, it was tired.

41:15.862 --> 41:18.764
[SPEAKER_01]: Was this a bunch of social media posts and some emails?

41:18.844 --> 41:21.366
[SPEAKER_01]: And nobody really got out there and brought it up.

41:21.687 --> 41:23.928
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, first of all, good.

41:24.489 --> 41:27.271
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I was just saying, I was so disappointed.

41:28.312 --> 41:34.377
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not going to go out and say, like, growing up, like, I even understood,

41:36.686 --> 41:39.248
[SPEAKER_01]: how to stand up against that kind of hate.

41:40.249 --> 41:51.179
[SPEAKER_01]: I was taught as a young person, like, you know, if you have the opportunity to stick up for someone who needs help, you can stand for someone who needs help.

41:51.240 --> 41:54.503
[SPEAKER_01]: Like that's your privilege and that's your responsibility to do.

41:54.543 --> 41:57.205
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and I, you know, I wouldn't really equate it

42:00.940 --> 42:18.569
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... to to homosexuals or heterosexuality gives more along the lines of like you know someone smaller than you or maybe someone who's a different race than you and and and and this person is picking on them for some reason but that like is still pretty um... instinctual to me is to go like okay this is wrong

42:19.370 --> 42:28.393
[SPEAKER_01]: Here's here's this community that really can't stick up for themselves in the same way because of the national politics going on right now.

42:28.453 --> 42:34.636
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like I have this tiny little podcast that we made it a point to have this conversation because this is like man.

42:36.177 --> 42:42.661
[SPEAKER_01]: If anything, being out here in California in the Bay Area, you feel like most people get it.

42:42.961 --> 42:47.263
[SPEAKER_01]: And here are three people or four people playing for the spaceball team that absolutely did not.

42:47.423 --> 42:53.226
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they hire Archie who absolutely did not know how to clean this up in any way.

42:53.266 --> 42:54.547
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's still out there.

42:54.567 --> 43:01.430
[SPEAKER_01]: What happened to Wala goes, so it's not as much conversation but the haze is still there.

43:01.470 --> 43:04.712
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just like, yeah, I wouldn't have figured it out.

43:05.272 --> 43:09.736
[SPEAKER_00]: I, you know, first of all, it's like, Motherfucker, you and San Francisco.

43:10.096 --> 43:12.618
[SPEAKER_00]: San Francisco is like gay people ground zero.

43:12.778 --> 43:14.219
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

43:14.240 --> 43:16.501
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're playing in San Francisco.

43:16.541 --> 43:28.892
[SPEAKER_00]: You must know that there are plenty of people on the LGBTQIA plus spectrum that come to your games or fans of your team or like whatever, like, don't, whatever your beliefs are.

43:29.947 --> 43:49.840
[SPEAKER_00]: don't come out and disrespect the people that pay your salary, you know, that's like if you have an issue with people on account of their sexual orientation, like keep that in your pocket, don't, you know, you don't need to make a statement.

43:50.200 --> 43:56.664
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think because of the political climate right now, there are people that feel empowered to make these kind of statements.

43:56.884 --> 43:57.544
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know,

43:59.806 --> 44:04.911
[SPEAKER_00]: if I was a San Francisco Giants fan, I would be really, really disappointed.

44:04.991 --> 44:22.827
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean the same way that, you know, it just came out that MSG, Donlin had people kind of keep a log of all the celebrities that came to the garden and were like keeping track of like, you know, queer celebrities, I'm not going to another event at Madison Square Garden.

44:23.847 --> 44:24.688
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know,

44:26.243 --> 44:29.404
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, it people are like pushing stuff under the rug.

44:29.764 --> 44:33.246
[SPEAKER_00]: People aren't like standing up for this privilege.

44:33.526 --> 44:35.527
[SPEAKER_00]: People certainly aren't reading the Bible.

44:37.027 --> 44:45.931
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, all of these dudes who are like writing chapter and verses scripture, like on a capsum shit, like that, it's like turning the Bible into memes.

44:46.131 --> 44:46.791
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what you're like.

44:47.211 --> 44:50.893
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, I'm like, I bet if we go through the Bible right now,

44:51.733 --> 44:58.776
[SPEAKER_00]: We can find 10 things in there that are against, that you're doing, that are against what's in the Bible.

44:58.996 --> 45:02.417
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, so it's just like, you don't even have a leg to stand on.

45:03.738 --> 45:05.098
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I don't know.

45:05.198 --> 45:06.739
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I mean, that's shit.

45:06.779 --> 45:08.999
[SPEAKER_00]: These are bad taste in my mouth.

45:09.540 --> 45:17.883
[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, I really, you know, I certainly appreciate people who are allies and do stand up to things like that.

45:18.623 --> 45:20.825
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, there's just whatever audience you had.

45:21.105 --> 45:35.716
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's always the conversation of stick to sports or whatever, you know, they are a, they are a, I don't know, I don't know, sports seems technically companies.

45:35.736 --> 45:42.642
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, know the exact designation, but, you know, like there's, there's excuses as to why people

45:44.098 --> 45:50.440
[SPEAKER_01]: don't care or maybe it eases themselves, you know, they eases themselves to not care because they don't think about things like this.

45:50.760 --> 45:51.340
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

45:51.680 --> 45:58.122
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, I think we, we are our show, there's a small audience.

45:58.882 --> 46:07.685
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if we turn people away with the conversation, but for Brad and myself, we're like, no, like this affects us as

46:09.768 --> 46:18.611
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, men in our 50s and how we view the world versus what we see as a kind of a going backwards in a sense.

46:18.691 --> 46:18.871
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

46:18.931 --> 46:29.654
[SPEAKER_01]: I think a lot of people feel that way with the current president that it's like we were evolving in certain ways and now we're kind of like going back going backwards.

46:41.999 --> 46:58.374
[SPEAKER_00]: to stand up for, you know, your beliefs, and I mean, you know, obviously there are situations in which you may have to be a little bit quieter about things than some others, but if you created a platform, you have the ability to say and do whatever you want.

46:58.915 --> 47:01.677
[SPEAKER_00]: And I do think that people who do have platforms like this.

47:02.978 --> 47:30.092
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, when you're other podcasts platforms should be using those platforms to not just talk about music or sports or whatever it is, but to, you know, shed light on things that are going on that affects people in their lives and, you know, bottom line is, you know, this particular podcast with the people that are watching, you know, there is, I mean, we're both people of color, you know, I am a member of the queer community and if you don't like people of color, if you don't like queer people, you should not be listening to this podcast.

47:31.507 --> 47:38.893
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I agree with that because you know that that's kind of just who we are in

47:40.049 --> 48:07.115
[SPEAKER_01]: what we stand for and what we will continue to stand for and what you know people close to us who are really close to us will always stand for to correct all right let's get back to frank but i'm happy that we had that conversation because when i listen to frank ocean or when i think about frank ocean i do think about that moment and how courageous it was and you know as a young person how again like kind of what i said about you

48:08.220 --> 48:14.543
[SPEAKER_01]: how many people he comforted in that moment, how many people he supported in that moment who were like, I feel seen in that moment.

48:14.583 --> 48:16.363
[SPEAKER_00]: How many people felt seen?

48:16.704 --> 48:17.144
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

48:17.244 --> 48:24.327
[SPEAKER_00]: That I think was the biggest takeaway from that whole thing is that there's always been gay people in hip hop.

48:24.367 --> 48:34.211
[SPEAKER_00]: There's always been, I mean, and not even gay, because I believe that I don't know what Frank's sexual orientation is, I assume he's bisexual, because he still has something about women.

48:34.551 --> 48:34.731
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

48:37.347 --> 48:47.550
[SPEAKER_00]: like there has never been a moment in hip hop or any musical genre where there are not queer people in the room.

48:48.570 --> 49:00.674
[SPEAKER_00]: They may not be out to you, they may not be out to themselves, but every, you know, every genre, every city, every community, every everything, there are queer people in it.

49:01.914 --> 49:03.715
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think he allowed

49:04.835 --> 49:08.717
[SPEAKER_00]: queer people queer men in particular to be seen for the first time.

49:09.318 --> 49:11.319
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, he's not a, well, he is a rapper.

49:11.359 --> 49:16.581
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess kind of he wraps on occasion to be seen in a in the hip hop community.

49:17.842 --> 49:20.624
[SPEAKER_01]: So channel orange drops soon thereafter.

49:21.984 --> 49:28.468
[SPEAKER_01]: And it is it is just a great album like it is like right out of the gate.

49:30.069 --> 49:31.930
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it hit immediately.

49:32.933 --> 49:37.934
[SPEAKER_01]: And the impact was really felt like almost immediately.

49:37.954 --> 49:40.335
[SPEAKER_01]: They saw like this thing sold the most records.

49:40.355 --> 49:43.376
[SPEAKER_01]: Like we just went over the Taylor Swift and the Katy Perry numbers.

49:43.436 --> 49:45.276
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are the ones and Adele.

49:45.316 --> 49:47.217
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are the ones that are selling all these records.

49:47.277 --> 49:55.138
[SPEAKER_01]: But like to me, you put channel orange up against any of their works.

49:55.219 --> 50:00.960
[SPEAKER_01]: Adele is a little bit different because she's been just been able to kind of

50:01.982 --> 50:09.829
[SPEAKER_01]: do the reverse of the Taylor Swift in the sense, which is kind of stay out of public mind and then come back and put an album out and then sell it again and kind of go back and hiding.

50:09.869 --> 50:17.536
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, Frank, the impact of this album, I think is huge compared to the record sales that it did.

50:17.576 --> 50:18.597
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, 100%.

50:20.185 --> 50:25.306
[SPEAKER_01]: So, debut that number two, selling 131,000 copies this first week.

50:25.706 --> 50:32.267
[SPEAKER_01]: The first single, thinking about you, was his highest charting single, reaching 32.

50:33.268 --> 50:43.670
[SPEAKER_01]: There were other singles, pyramids, sweet-life loss, super-rich kids, but they weren't really commercial songs in the way of that you would hear things on radio.

50:45.731 --> 50:55.627
[SPEAKER_01]: And so, you know, from a critical standpoint, one of the best reviewed albums of the year, we'll get to the Grammys in a second, because I have some beef with what was going on there.

50:59.752 --> 51:05.118
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, he, I think he's pretty influential to today's artists.

51:05.359 --> 51:10.204
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't, you know, I don't know who kind of wears his name on their sleeve as far as influences.

51:10.264 --> 51:14.589
[SPEAKER_01]: But I hear that in some of the artists that I can actually stomach these days.

51:14.870 --> 51:15.090
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

51:15.430 --> 51:17.472
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, pretty much anybody who makes

51:19.207 --> 51:22.750
[SPEAKER_00]: R&B, that's a little different sounding now, I think.

51:23.351 --> 51:36.681
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, to call Frank Ocean R&B is kind of weird because it's not really R&B music, you know, but everybody from, in like, I feel bad because I've not plugged in to modern,

51:37.742 --> 51:58.193
[SPEAKER_00]: music as much, but even like there's a dude out, Drambranar that I really, really like who is openly gay and is able to like get down with the hip-hop community and make records that feature like been staples and like all these other people and you know, there wouldn't be a Drambranar if there wasn't a Frank Ocean.

51:58.774 --> 52:01.976
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I mean Tyler kind of came out.

52:03.038 --> 52:06.620
[SPEAKER_00]: at some point, and I don't even know if that would have been possible without Frank Ocean.

52:06.981 --> 52:07.201
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

52:07.441 --> 52:22.411
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, and I, you know, one thing about that album in particular that I think is really interesting is how many people, like, pull up to be on that record, like, for else on that record, John Mayors on that record, Andre 3000's on that record.

52:22.471 --> 52:25.213
[SPEAKER_01]: Andre 3000's on both albums, blonde too.

52:25.473 --> 52:26.154
[SPEAKER_01]: Is he on blonde?

52:26.194 --> 52:27.354
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he's on blonde as well.

52:27.695 --> 52:28.215
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't know that.

52:28.435 --> 52:31.297
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and I also don't think that I'm came with like credits or anything like that.

52:32.698 --> 52:35.459
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I was listening to multiple of them and I was like, oh, I'm trace on this one too.

52:36.000 --> 52:46.065
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, speaking of people who said homophobic things at one point in their career and completely reverse course, um, but he got like the cream of the crop on his record.

52:46.785 --> 52:50.027
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, they didn't need it because he's, you know, a self-contained center songwriter.

52:51.467 --> 52:56.889
[SPEAKER_01]: So the albums we mentioned in the mixed tape, so channel orange is 2012.

52:57.870 --> 53:04.813
[SPEAKER_01]: Endless is the visual album that was the last album on Death Jam.

53:05.894 --> 53:12.216
[SPEAKER_01]: And the very next day, blonde comes out, which is his self-released project.

53:12.256 --> 53:12.877
[SPEAKER_01]: And blonde,

53:13.657 --> 53:36.169
[SPEAKER_01]: you know he had the hype from channel orange and it's like okay we want more of this dude and he's still doing these on hooks he's right and stuff still so he's his he's out there but he makes people wait for four years for blonde to come out right and uh blonde uh hit hit pretty big

53:37.850 --> 54:00.447
[SPEAKER_01]: It was I think people were like okay like this dude is absolutely 100% for real Rookie album is awesome sophomore album is awesome like he's here to stay and then he just wasn't like as far as new music is concerned because here we are We are here 10 years later and there has been no follow-up nope Frank Ocean pull the Lauren Hill

54:02.427 --> 54:04.148
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I don't think for the same reasons though.

54:04.608 --> 54:08.129
[SPEAKER_00]: No, Frank was just like, I'm a like I got my money.

54:08.189 --> 54:22.613
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a do me and he he pops up on like other people's records from time to time But I think he's just kind of like living his life All right, some other song writing credits for Frank so we mentioned the Bieber album.

54:22.713 --> 54:27.835
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess Beyonce's I miss you is a is a frank ocean song

54:29.115 --> 54:57.497
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... a couple of songs from human twenty twelve's human the brandy album that we talked about first in love and lock it are his uh... girl on fire and no girl on fire was uh... uh... was a frank ocean song but leech of keys he has a writing credit on uh... role fire maybe it's not maybe it's not the actual song but uh... he's got a writing credit on that album

54:58.292 --> 55:02.815
[SPEAKER_01]: uh, and quickly, uh, by John Legend in Brandy.

55:03.255 --> 55:03.495
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

55:04.376 --> 55:05.517
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a really good song, too.

55:05.757 --> 55:05.977
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

55:07.218 --> 55:10.179
[SPEAKER_01]: So no church in the wild.

55:12.221 --> 55:13.101
[SPEAKER_01]: Holy shit.

55:13.982 --> 55:15.102
[SPEAKER_01]: That's such a great song.

55:16.864 --> 55:24.608
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything about the, I mean, you know, the Kanye stuff is the Kanye stuff, but we talked about why we, we chose to review that album.

55:25.029 --> 55:27.190
[SPEAKER_01]: Right versus a solo Kanye album.

55:29.040 --> 55:38.126
[SPEAKER_01]: That is like a insanely creative yet perfectly put together hip-up song with two guys at the peak of their powers.

55:38.226 --> 55:42.709
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you got this other dude who kind of steals it from them, I think.

55:44.270 --> 55:47.032
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I like Jay's, I like Jay's rhymes on that album.

55:47.332 --> 55:54.417
[SPEAKER_01]: But when I listen to that, the hauntingness of that track, what I'm expecting to hear is Frank Ocean's voice.

55:54.922 --> 56:16.909
[SPEAKER_00]: yeah i mean every element of that song i think is really special from like the production to you know that sort of like auto tune part by the dream like all of that stuff is is really cool uh but i think Frank's chorus like as much as the song has a chorus i guess um is really integral to to that song

56:18.159 --> 56:47.094
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he's also on another song with Kanye or is it is Kanye on this one made in America is a Jay Z track I think both of them are on I don't I can't remember that song well enough to tell you for sure I guess it is on watch the throne as well yeah it's on watch the throne yeah but that song is not as good no it's still the best part of that song to me is Frank Ocean's voice yeah who does to Frank

56:47.598 --> 56:47.758
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

56:47.798 --> 56:55.924
[SPEAKER_00]: And then he was on a couple of songs on 444, um, like, I mean, him and Jay have done quite a few records together.

56:58.206 --> 57:05.752
[SPEAKER_01]: So if we go, uh, if we fast forward to kind of the making of of channel orange.

57:06.572 --> 57:08.654
[SPEAKER_01]: So do you know the how to pronounce the name

57:17.872 --> 57:30.186
[SPEAKER_01]: So Frank wanted to write all of the songs and like a short amount of time, but I think through maybe through the influence of the producer's like, you know, like let's take some time here.

57:30.927 --> 57:38.176
[SPEAKER_01]: The album title, now I don't even understand really what this means, channel orange references

57:39.945 --> 58:01.591
[SPEAKER_01]: Grafim, color, synithesia, a neurological phenomenon where letters numbers or sounds trigger the perception of colors and he chose the orange as a reference to the hue he perceived during the summer he fell in love.

58:02.211 --> 58:05.972
[SPEAKER_01]: So he saw the color orange when he fell in love.

58:07.051 --> 58:33.758
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... while the student's just creative on different levels for me to even understand and i'm definitely like synesthesia is when people uh... here things and they see colors as a result of what they hear you know which i've you know i think a few musicians experience that but you know i mean that is pretty creative yeah it's very creative uh... so what is your favorite song on this album um

58:35.272 --> 58:38.153
[SPEAKER_00]: man, that's hard.

58:40.393 --> 58:43.014
[SPEAKER_00]: Probably super rich kids.

58:43.314 --> 58:50.156
[SPEAKER_00]: I love the fact that there's actually an episode of good times playing in the background for the entire song.

58:50.236 --> 58:54.417
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that super creative thinking about use a great song.

58:56.097 --> 58:59.198
[SPEAKER_00]: I think from like a songwriting perspective,

59:00.303 --> 59:24.914
[SPEAKER_00]: bad religion that song just like I almost can't listen to that song because that's just like you know that's one of those songs that like hits me a certain way right um i think if you've ever had feelings for someone who did not return those feelings for you it's gonna like that song is gonna hit a little different um yeah i mean there's a bunch of great songs on that album

59:30.396 --> 59:57.593
[SPEAKER_01]: best thing I could say about it is there are songs that I like a little bit more than others but they connect to each other in a way where I sometimes get lost in what song is on because the album just feels like one long song and it's just like like sometimes like when I was doing the re-listening I had to listen to this album

59:58.907 --> 01:00:02.410
[SPEAKER_01]: upwards of like six or seven times because I'd have it on the background and I'm working.

01:00:03.110 --> 01:00:08.534
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I look at the song title and I was like, wait, what happened to the other five songs that I just listened to?

01:00:08.554 --> 01:00:11.136
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's just because they just flowed together.

01:00:11.196 --> 01:00:22.765
[SPEAKER_01]: So well, blonde is like that similarly, um, you know, in my relicins, let's just like you just kind of get lost in the vibe and the ambiance and the music.

01:00:23.365 --> 01:00:36.090
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't even really think about like what song is coming on like oh, I can't wait for this song my favorite song It's just it's just there and it just goes and yeah the biggest compliment I can play the pay this album I agree.

01:00:36.211 --> 01:00:50.176
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's You know, I'm not gonna compare Frank Ocean and Stevie But if you listen to an album like intervisions or you listen to an album like talking book It is really hard sometimes to separate the songs because the album is such like

01:00:52.182 --> 01:00:57.684
[SPEAKER_00]: a complete piece and a channel orange kind of feels the same way.

01:00:59.484 --> 01:01:09.167
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, it's hard to compare the two artists, but like, there's a, like, this is like a descendant in a sense.

01:01:09.187 --> 01:01:17.150
[SPEAKER_01]: I think, like, like he, Frank, like I don't know how much Stevie Frank listened to, but I feel like he probably heard quite a bit.

01:01:17.170 --> 01:01:19.591
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I would guess, but like,

01:01:20.525 --> 01:01:46.937
[SPEAKER_01]: you know thinking going back to the synesthesia thing like I don't know that you know steve you know being a blind man like I don't know how he associates color or whatever like that whole thought process but like he's hearing things and seeing things that other artists aren't seeing and I imagine that Frank is a similar way right all right so

01:01:48.712 --> 01:02:04.278
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, let's, let's hit our, uh, Grammy Redux situation here because, uh, when I look back at this stuff, I couldn't actually believe what happened at the 2013 gram, I, I'm freezing myself.

01:02:04.699 --> 01:02:04.959
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

01:02:04.999 --> 01:02:06.919
[SPEAKER_00]: So let's start with best new artist.

01:02:08.400 --> 01:02:08.700
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

01:02:09.601 --> 01:02:14.162
[SPEAKER_01]: The, the nominees, the luminaires, hunter

01:02:19.213 --> 01:02:29.404
[SPEAKER_00]: Didn't fun when that fun won this and then broke up right after I mean, I, you know,

01:02:32.887 --> 01:02:35.649
[SPEAKER_00]: frank ocean is certainly my favorite of those five.

01:02:36.669 --> 01:02:49.357
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't, you know, I think all five of those artists are talented in their own right, whatever, but I mean, I, you know, if I was Mr. Granny, like frank ocean would have gotten that award for me.

01:02:50.097 --> 01:02:51.178
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, 100%.

01:02:51.458 --> 01:02:56.861
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, now we'll go out of the year because Channel Orange is nominated for out of the year.

01:02:58.222 --> 01:03:00.783
[SPEAKER_01]: The other nominees, fun with

01:03:02.723 --> 01:03:10.154
[SPEAKER_01]: The Black Keys, El Camino, Jack White, Blunderbus, and Mumford and Suns for Babel.

01:03:11.284 --> 01:03:14.887
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, mumford and son's won that award again.

01:03:14.907 --> 01:03:16.909
[SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't have given that award to Frank Ocean.

01:03:19.250 --> 01:03:21.993
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just, you know, I love Jack White.

01:03:23.234 --> 01:03:24.234
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the black keys.

01:03:25.976 --> 01:03:30.759
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, fun was kind of cool for what they were in that particular moment.

01:03:31.820 --> 01:03:36.304
[SPEAKER_00]: But I do think that Frank Ocean album is the one of those five that sticks for me.

01:03:38.005 --> 01:03:38.486
[SPEAKER_01]: So then,

01:03:39.657 --> 01:03:44.301
[SPEAKER_01]: for the 2017 Grammys, Frank's like nah, not even letting this thing out.

01:03:44.321 --> 01:03:45.382
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he wasn't nominated.

01:03:45.602 --> 01:04:00.255
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, there was some beef because Frank performed on the Grammys that either the channel Orange Year and if a performance wasn't very good, I don't think Frank Ocean is a particularly good live performer.

01:04:00.275 --> 01:04:01.316
[SPEAKER_00]: And,

01:04:04.073 --> 01:04:21.656
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe the Grammy producers like actually said something about his performance in like we're really critical of it and like Frank Clapback and was like I don't need a fucking Grammy anywhere like fuck y'all and then you know very deliberately kept blonde out of the didn't even submit it for nomination

01:04:23.231 --> 01:04:34.293
[SPEAKER_01]: So he did win for best urban contemporary album for channel orange and then no church in the wild wins for best rap song collaboration.

01:04:34.733 --> 01:04:34.953
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

01:04:36.854 --> 01:04:47.616
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we were not gonna do a jam in Lewis or LaFace segment because that, you don't understand Frank Ocean if we even run this through that process.

01:04:47.776 --> 01:04:48.876
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's that's here.

01:04:53.342 --> 01:05:04.325
[SPEAKER_01]: If you were to predict now here we are in July of 2016, do we see a Frank song?

01:05:04.365 --> 01:05:05.986
[SPEAKER_01]: Do we see a Frank album?

01:05:06.366 --> 01:05:09.146
[SPEAKER_01]: Is he just going to be guessing on stuff like what?

01:05:09.707 --> 01:05:10.867
[SPEAKER_01]: How will we see him?

01:05:11.487 --> 01:05:12.467
[SPEAKER_01]: I want another album.

01:05:12.827 --> 01:05:14.088
[SPEAKER_01]: I imagine I would love another album.

01:05:14.248 --> 01:05:16.088
[SPEAKER_01]: Tons of other people who want another album.

01:05:16.168 --> 01:05:22.150
[SPEAKER_01]: I know my two kids that I mentioned, they would break down the doors to get another album.

01:05:23.192 --> 01:05:25.473
[SPEAKER_01]: And do we see one, do you think?

01:05:26.234 --> 01:05:26.654
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

01:05:27.334 --> 01:05:29.876
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he, again, I think he's on his Lauren Hill shit.

01:05:30.276 --> 01:05:39.300
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's just like, I'm doing, but on a much, much more immensely stable version of it, and he's like, I'm gonna do what I wanna do.

01:05:39.781 --> 01:05:43.322
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he's thinking about like, I could, what I do is like making a movie.

01:05:45.323 --> 01:05:46.364
[SPEAKER_00]: So who knows?

01:05:46.484 --> 01:05:50.026
[SPEAKER_00]: He might, I think he just wants to do like cool weird shit.

01:05:51.012 --> 01:05:53.295
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, she's part of the outfuture man.

01:05:53.575 --> 01:05:58.402
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, if J pops, if J makes another record, maybe, you know, maybe Frank will pull up for that.

01:05:59.323 --> 01:06:01.746
[SPEAKER_01]: J is doing some concerts this weekend, right?

01:06:01.766 --> 01:06:03.969
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the Yankee Stadium concert this weekend.

01:06:04.910 --> 01:06:06.052
[SPEAKER_01]: Had, did you hear anything about it?

01:06:06.661 --> 01:06:20.149
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I mean, I've seen people posting videos of them there, which to me is insane because those tickets are like $500 a pop and like, I'm not paying $500 to see Jesus.

01:06:20.489 --> 01:06:32.116
[SPEAKER_00]: So, that idea of that is kind of like, again, it's kind of gross to me and like shame on J, like you got enough money, you could have,

01:06:32.776 --> 01:06:37.499
[SPEAKER_00]: made this affordable for some of your day ones, you know why they do that though.

01:06:37.980 --> 01:06:40.221
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know why, but the audience doesn't.

01:06:40.301 --> 01:06:43.863
[SPEAKER_01]: It's because the secondary market is off the chart.

01:06:44.064 --> 01:06:48.206
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like, do you give the money to the brokers or do you keep the money?

01:06:48.246 --> 01:06:51.108
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, it's kind of a a no-in there, I think.

01:06:51.569 --> 01:06:53.110
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's insane.

01:06:54.390 --> 01:06:55.991
[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, I've heard good things about the

01:07:00.340 --> 01:07:07.806
[SPEAKER_00]: Beyonce obviously and Blue Ivy came out and did some stuff with him, you know, Eminem came out, uh, slick Rick came out.

01:07:07.846 --> 01:07:11.789
[SPEAKER_00]: He's well, you know, yeah, for oh, yeah, that's not not as nauseous.

01:07:11.829 --> 01:07:12.089
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:07:12.109 --> 01:07:16.653
[SPEAKER_01]: Like a date, Darrell Strawberry jacket or something because that's a Darrell was pretty happy about that.

01:07:17.053 --> 01:07:17.353
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:07:18.053 --> 01:07:18.333
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:07:18.433 --> 01:07:21.514
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, Jay and Oz did some stuff together.

01:07:21.534 --> 01:07:22.194
[SPEAKER_01]: What was Frank?

01:07:22.234 --> 01:07:23.275
[SPEAKER_01]: Frank should have been out there.

01:07:23.335 --> 01:07:23.635
[SPEAKER_01]: Come on.

01:07:23.675 --> 01:07:32.717
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's, it may be if they do, uh, I mean, has, I mean, he's celebrating a very specific anniversaries and I don't know if Frank was a part of any of that stuff.

01:07:32.757 --> 01:07:35.278
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, it wasn't even a thought at that point.

01:07:35.598 --> 01:07:35.818
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:07:37.138 --> 01:07:38.559
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, that is it from here.

01:07:39.459 --> 01:07:48.404
[SPEAKER_01]: Like we said, you know, the Frank didn't get the full on way that we normally do these albums, but it's because Frank is, he's keeping it to himself.

01:07:48.444 --> 01:07:51.225
[SPEAKER_01]: He's not putting out a ton of stuff, but I still think this was a...

01:07:51.245 --> 01:07:52.186
[SPEAKER_00]: Tight discography.

01:07:52.566 --> 01:07:55.769
[SPEAKER_01]: I loved this conversation because I knew some of the themes that we were going to hit.

01:07:56.850 --> 01:08:09.580
[SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully people enjoyed it as well, so we'll be back later this week with a cool check in because we're not going to have a top five for Frank, but we're going to do an episode on a physical media, including vinyl.

01:08:10.476 --> 01:08:16.843
[SPEAKER_01]: And I want to talk to Mike about his collection and maybe some Grails that are still out there that he wants.

01:08:18.145 --> 01:08:18.505
[SPEAKER_01]: And such.

01:08:18.525 --> 01:08:23.751
[SPEAKER_01]: So all right, fit to for 50.net if you want to check us out, all the stuff in the archives on the website.

01:08:24.793 --> 01:08:26.114
[SPEAKER_01]: So for Mike, I'm WG.

01:08:26.214 --> 01:08:26.975
[SPEAKER_01]: See you when we see you.

01:08:27.155 --> 01:08:28.177
[SPEAKER_01]: Peace out.